Vets Don't Always Get it Right

Most Vets Don't Deserve
Your Respect or Your Business

Most Veterinarians do not Deserve Your Respect or Your Business

puppy

I have little doubt that every person who enters Vet school does so with good intentions. I would guess that every young person who chooses a career in Veterinary medicine loves animals and wants to spend their life working with animals. A few maintain this compassion throughout their career. We happen to know and trust several people like this. They have our trust, they have our respect and we like to think of them as friends.

After 45 years of owning, breeding, training and loving dogs we have come to the conclusion that a Vet must earn our trust and respect. We no longer automatically anoint a person just because we walk into their office and they have a diploma on the wall that's says DMV.

Unfortunately our experience is that the majority people who become Vets don't deserve any respect at all. In fact far to many of them are incompetent prostitutes who should have their licenses revoked.

The fact is something happens to these people after they graduate from Vet school.

Many Vet school graduates turn into arrogant asses. They develop the GOD SYNDROM with egos the size of automobiles (you see this with human doctors too). Whatever happens don't question their diagnosis or their experience. They have Doctors of Veterinary Medicine (DMV) behind their name and you dam well better respect that fact.

The perfect example of this is seen when you ask a Vet about the all-natural diet. 98% of them will belittle the concept. A recent Vet conference in Las Vegas had a meeting on the all-natural diet. It focused on how to sell customers off of the concept. I.E. Pet owners are not qualified to understand the nutritional needs their dogs. Hmmmmm !! Most people do a pretty good job of feeding themselves, their children and their family. When Vets make comments like this in my book it's the same as calling their client stupid. Give me a break.

Many Vets become cynical because they graduate from Vet school and quickly find out that they will never get rich in this profession. So they try and prove that theory wrong by selling services that the pet owners don't need. They in effect become what I call a Veterinary prostitute.

There is a link on our web board from a TV station in Southern CA. that just did an investigation into Vets. They took the same animal to 10 different Vet clinic. It is Unbelievable what all of these vets recommended. No two were the same and a number of them were outright criminal in what they recommended. Maybe you should recommend your local TV station do a similar investigation.

Many Vets walk away from Vet school and never look back. They think there is little else to learn. When in fact they may have had 6 hours of training on canine nutrition and 4 hours of instruction on behavioral problems and dog training. Give me a break!! People who graduate from a 10 week basic dog obedience course at their local animal shelter know moore about training dogs than most Vets.

In most Vets mind the solution to most behavioral problems in dogs is found in a prescription bottle full of tranquilizers. The wouldn't understand the concept of pack structure and leadership is their practice depended on it.

Lets also point out the subject of vaccinations or I should say TOO MANY VACCINATIONS. In recent years it has become more and more apparent as more and more studies are proving that yearly vaccinations are not only not needed they are detrimental to the health of your pet. Read the article I wrote on Vaccinosis (reactions dogs have from being vaccinated)

Study after study can come out and major Veterinary Medical Universities have recommended new protocols (less vaccinations) yet ask your Vet what he thinks about yearly vaccinations. When they say this is all hog wash what you are seeing is a Vet that's more interested in your wallet than the health of your dog.

While we are on the topic of education lets point out that the majority of additional training most Vets get is provided by the drug companies or the dog food companies. Boy those are sure two respectable groups of people in my book. Once only needs to look at the recent dog food recall to verify their credibility.

Next time you walk into your Vets office look around. Do you see piles of Science Diet or Eucanuba? Two of the companies listed in the pet food recall. Do some research on these two brands of dogs foods. You may find out exactly what kind of garbage really goes into the bag. When you see this crap in a Vets office you know he gave up the ghost and cares more about your wallet than your dogs nutritional needs.

We get a lot of emails here at Leerburg. Cindy and I try and answer them all. On a regular basis we get emails from people who have had terrible experiences with incompetent Vets. I have included some of those emails at the end of this article. I am going to make a point of adding more of them.

The following is just today's example.

Today's E-mail:

Ed,

I had two 11 week old Chihuahua puppies. I just lost his sister to Parvo. I purchased the pups together from a breeder so they would have each other when I am not around. Unfortunately one of the puppies died from Parvo. Of course I am concerned about the other puppy getting Parvo. I am keeping a close watch on him and getting his vaccinations in a few days. My training issue is this: Both pups were great about not using the crate for peeing and pooping when they were together. Now that I only have one pup, he is peeing and pooping in his crate. Can this behavior be stress related?

Thanks in advance... it's been an emotional week.

OUR ANSWER

Before I address the training issue, I would caution you about getting a puppy vaccinated after it’s already been exposed to parvo. Being exposed to a disease and not becoming ill, is in effect a vaccination.

Giving a vaccine to a puppy whose immune system is dealing with a recent parvo exposure may be deadly. If your pup never becomes sick, he will likely be immune to parvo as he has received “nature’s vaccine” which is the best way to build immunity. Read our vaccinosis article http://leerburg.com/vaccinosis.htm

Your pup may be suffering from a bit of separation anxiety, so I would offer him love, firm leadership and structure.

I recently finished a project I have been working on for years titled COMMON SENSE SOULTION TO HOUSE TRAINING PROBLEMS.

This is a 160 page e-book that that is based on how we house train pups in our home (I have bred over 360 litters in the last 45 years). It is also based on 10 years of emails on house training problems from people like yourself.

In my opinion this ebook is the best collection of information on how to house train a dog that’s ever been put together.

I have reviewed your email and this ebook along with my DVD titled YOUR PUPPY 8 WEEKS to 8 MONTHS http://leerburg.com/120.htm will guide you through the issues you will face in solving your problems

The Follow Up Email

Thanks for getting back to me. I got your e-mail after that fact. I did take my puppy Buddy to the vet yesterday and he got his Canine Bord Vacc #Nasal and DHPP-C .

I hope this does not hurt him. Now I am worried more than ever.

Our Conclusion

This Vet who is either AN IDIOT or a PROSTITUE or BOTH !!!! This is incompetence at its best. Without a doubt this person should not be a vet. He or she is exactly the type of person I am writing this article about. They are an insult to their profession.

Do I sound negative here? Yes because I am disgusted with the Veterinary industry. They don't police themselves.

Nothing is more valuable than a good relationship with your vet. This article is not about all those great vets we use to help with the healthcare needs of our dogs. This article is about those less than ethical vets who are more interested in making money than practicing good medicine. It's also about those arrogant vets who think they know something about dog training and dog behavior when in fact they know little to nothing.

This is not to say that ALL vets are bad. My personal vet is not good, she is GREAT. She is honest about things that she does not know and she works with Cindy and I to help keep our dogs healthy. Unlike most vets, she is also open minded about the raw diet and alternative medicine. We are also lucky enough to have access to one of the most professional breeding specialists in the UNited States. I cannot tell you how lucky we are to have found this man and to be able to take our dogs to his clinic.

Send us your emails:

If you have horor stories about your local Vet - send us an email and we will add your email to this web page. We don't need to include your name or email address or the name of the Vet. The purpose of this web page is to make people do a little research about who they choose as a health care provider for their dog. New dog owners should not be sheep where the blind leads the blind.

Read the emails below and PLEASE CHOOSE A VET CAREFULLY!!! When you find a good Vet - covet him like a best friend. Recommend his to your friends and beighbors. Spread the news that you have found a gem and eveyone should support this person.

Sue the Bastards

But if you have experiences like those below - my recommendation is the sue the Vet. Take him or her to small claims court or hire an attorney and let him do the work for you. In the state of Wisconsin you can spend $50.00 and sue in small claims for up to $5,000.00. Often times this does not cover the emotional or monitary loss involved but it will sure give the fool some unwanted advertising.

Question:

Hi Cindy,

I was extremely interested in feeding my puppy Embark from The Honest Kitchen…however when I suggested it to my vet he discourage RAW foods as he says that bacterial overgrowth is a major concern. He stated that you wouldn't’t feed your kids raw meats and dogs will have the same health issues with eating uncooked foods as people would have. I then mentioned The Honest Kitchen foods and he said he hadn’t heard of it…but when I told him that it was soft mixture he immediately discouraged it because of dental hygiene issues. He said that I would be hard pressed to find any veterinarian that would recommend a RAW diet or 100% soft diet.

After meeting with the Vet I left with questions on whether I should continue my thoughts of feeding the Honest Kitchen or stick with a high grade kibble?

Your thoughts and comments?

Eric

Cindy's Answer:

First of all, I would find a new vet. I worked as a vet tech for over 15 years, I have fed a raw diet since 1993 and your veterinarian needs to become a bit more educated. Dogs can tolerate bacteria that would kill us…. They lick their butts and eat deer poop, etc. with no ill effects.

I recommend the books we sell Raw Dog Food-Make it easy for you and your dog and Natural Nutrition for Dogs & Cats. Both of these books are excellent and cover many common concerns and misconceptions.

Our vet here in Menomonie, WI advocates a raw diet and there is a holistic vet in Blaine, MN that not only recommends a raw diet, she sells it also. I am sure there are many vets in the Twin Cities area that use a more holistic and natural approach to nutrition and medical care for your dog. I have used the vet in Blaine and she is awesome, she was thrilled to find out that I was a raw feeder..she said it’s the most important thing you can do for the health of your animals.

Whether food is hard or soft has nothing to do with dental hygiene, this statement just shows your vet's level of ignorance. Kibble is one of the worst things for dental health, dogs chew it and it coats their teeth. Dogs are meant to rip and tear chunks and swallow it, their teeth are not designed to chew little processed chunks of kibble. The HK products are lapped up and swallowed, not chewed.

I get really tired of vets that try scare tactics about a raw diet, when they aren’t even educated about it at all.

You need to make your own choices about what’s best for your own dog, I can’t do that for you. I did tons of research and waded thru a lot of information to get to where I am today and I am constantly learning and trying to find better ways to do things.

Ed's Answer:

Eric

This may be one of the dumbest comments I have heard from a vet in the past years. Although there are a few more listed below. People like this are an embarrassment to well educated intelligent animal healthcare providers.

Feeding a Raw Diet

eBook

A VET WHO CALLED THE CHIEF BECAUSE THE HANDLER FED AN ALL-NATURAL DIET RATHER THAN PURINA DOG FOOD:

Ed,

I am a police K-9 handler. I recently switched my GSD over to a Raw diet back in January at the recommendation of a friend. Prior to this he was getting Purina Joint Formula at the direction of the vet. The dog just turned 2 and has NO medical issues. The food was donated by the vet through Purina because he is a working dog. Because of this I informed my Vet of the raw diet so they wouldn't wonder why I wasn't picking up food. (BAD IDEA). Long story short, I went to work last night and received a note
from the Chief, stating that the Vets called him and are extremely upset that I am feeding raw. They have told him that I am "risking the towns investment". They further state that I am risking my health as well in regards to Salmonella. My argument to that is that a little bleach on the counter after preparation and normal cleaning will prevent this. I feel all their claims are bogus. I just got this dog last May and was having bonding issues with him. Believe it or not, I feel that since feeding the raw he is much more bonded to me and seems to be a very happy dog. He whines incessantly when he sees me coming with his food and does circles in the kennel. Not only that he looks great. I get a ton of praise about how good he looks when I do demos. The reason I am writing you is I was wondering If
you have any information that I could share with my Chief or if you would be willing to speak with him about this if he wished to call you. It appears as if I am going to be forced to go back to feeding dry food. The Vets in town also give us free medical care for the dog. They made a statement to me a few
weeks ago that they had a client that was feeding raw and asked that client to find a different vet.

Thanks for all your help. I have purchased numerous items from you and found them all to be helpful. The web site is great as well and many of the other handlers here in our state use it regularly.

Jim

Ed's Comments on a Unethical Under-educated Vet:

This Vet is a bleeding uneducated fool. An absolute fool. If there is ever a case that is an example of a Vet that has his head stuck in a 40 year old HOLE IN THE GROUND this is it. He does not deserve to be called a Vet.

I wonder how he explains the fact that wolves, Foxes and Coyotes have seemed to live for millions of years and have never seen a bag of commercial dog food.

I know there is nothing you can do about it.

You may want to tell your chief about my site. I was a k9 handler for 10 years, head of the WI police K9 training committee for 3 or 4 years, have bred over 350 litters of working bloodline GSD's for 30 years, owned dogs for 45 years and have MUCH MORE EXPERIENCE than this fool Vet.

This Purina food is just their normal crap food with glucosamine on it. A joke.

That’s like putting GLUCOSAMINE on a BIG MAC and telling families that this is healthier for their kids - healthier than what? DOG CRAP?

Natural Nutrition for Dogs & Cats

Ed,

I have an almost three year old German Shepherd born in Germany. Because of transportation, she received a lot of shots. I want to breed her and made the mistake of allowing the vet to vaccinate her for Rabies when she was four days from flagging. She started with a vaginal discharge which gradually spread throughout her mammary glands - a bad fungus with probably a staph aureus infection. After much deliberation and trials with the vet, I started my own therapy.

I was a registered medical technologist and reversed my own severe case of fibromyalgia which was initiated by appendicitis at the age of seven and overdosing of penicillin which caused a reaction. So I did with her what I did with myself and that is to strengthen her immune system which was broken down by the vaccinations.

I would strongly recommend that anyone facing this double infection not to start with the antibiotic because that is a fungal derivative which will make the fungal problem worse. Start with treating the fungus. Amazingly, I had a lot of success without using the Malaseb baths like they tell you every week. Chlorophyll kills fungus so I gave her Yeast Defense, Chlorella, Spirullina, Barley Green, and Olive Leaf and I would rotate them. In addition, I gave her probiotics to re-establish her intestinal flora because that flora has much to do with her immune system and the bacteria are destroyed with stress. She had biological stress. I made an ear wash of Olive Leaf tea which seemed to help her ears. I gave her a lot of human grade things like Nordic Naturals Omega 3, some CoQ10, etc. Fungus, uses certain nutrients to build up their cell walls and compete for that same nutrient which is used by the Schwann cells to build up the myelin sheath that covers the nerves. So bad fungal problems can lead to neurological problems such as balance and coordination, etc.

Anyone dealing with fungal problems or vaccine problems needs to strengthen the immune system because that is what has been attacked and it is the immune system which will fight off the disease. I reversed my own neurological problem which involved balance and coordination, etc. This does work.

Donna Senesac

Ed's ANSWER concerning this bad advice from a Vet :

This is sad.

Any Vet that vaccinates a female in season is a friggin IDIOT !!! They should lose their medical license.

EMAIL FROM A VET:

I will try not to make this too long.

I came upon your web site accidentally and must say I am FLOORED by the incredibly rude, uneducated, barbaric advice you give people who ask you questions! These people are wanting honest, intelligent, accurate, educated answers to they're questions. Instead you give them WRONG answers, combat everything with SARCASM and foul language (ie. "your vet is a dumb ass") and obviously are one of the most unethical,dimwitted, SO CALLED breeders I have ever come across!

I will not lavishly praise myself as you are so incline to do, but I will let you know that I have been a licensed DVM for 27 years, and advise you to discontinue breeding, and giving any advice.

Producing over 300 litters in 25 years (or 350 in 30, depending on which post you happen to reply to) DOES NOT MAKE YOU AN EXPERT IN TRAINING, BREEDING, NUTRITION, OR VETERINARY MEDICINE!!!!!!

I am ANGRY people like you are out there doing what you do.

Find another "career" and leave the advice to the professionals!

Seairra Whitefeather

email calypsoldy57@msn.com

ED'S RESPONSE:

Thanks for the nice e-mail. I will put this on my web site under emails that make me laugh. I am also going to start a section on DUMB ASS VETS – your email will be the first one in that section. I forgot more about dogs last week than people like you learn in a lifetime.

Ed Frawley's Philosophy on Dog Training

eBook

Vet Recommends Stapling Stomach as a Normal Preventative Procedure

Mr. Frawley:

I have a four month old female german shepherd. I am feeding her a combination of Royal Canine kibble in the am and the dehydrated food I ordered from you in the pm.

I have taken her to the vet two times and both times the vet has told me how common bloat is and how devastating it would be to lose my dog to this malady. She strongly recommended surgery to sew her stomach in place promising that my dog will never get bloat.

I take precautions and I don't allow exercise for two hrs after eating. I am concerned she is appealing to my emotions vs this being a logical precautionary step to take.

I would appreciate your opinion on this surgery if you have the time to respond.

Thank you, Paula Booth in Atlanta.

Ed's Answer to stupid Vet Advice

To advise this for a dog that has never bloated is insane.

Find another Vet. If your dog has never bloated and this Vet is recommending this procedure as a preventative measure the Vet should lose her license to practice Veterinary medicine. If this is indeed what happened you should stop using this vet's services and report her to the state licensing agency.

This is one of the worst cases of bad medical advice that I have heard.

QUESTION on Puppy:

Dear Mr. Frawley,
I love your web site and am currently using your training video to train my puppy. I know you addressed too much exercise on your video, but I was wondering how long I can walk my puppy for? Every night my daughters and I go on an hour long exercise walk with our 2 6-year old female german shepherds. We walk at a semi fast rate (not that fast power walking). We stop halfway and rest for about 20 minutes. Our 5 month old male german shepherd puppy wants to come with us. We do walk him on little walks, but I think that this evening walk is too much for him. We let him come the other night and about 2/3 though he became tired. So I was wondering how old do you think he should be before we let him go on an hour long walk and how long of a should he have at his current age?
Also I wanted to thank you for your health info on your web site. When our puppy was younger he became ill with coccidia. I took him to the vet and the vet said he probably had parvo even though he tested negative for it and wanted to go ahead and treat him for parvo. I was fairly certain he had coccidia after going though your web site. I asked him to test him for it and he said it wasn't coccidia. I became insist ant that I wanted a lab test for it so he ran one and sure enough it was coccidia. He then got the treatment he needed and the vet gave him the same medicine and the IV under the skin treatment that you showed. He became ill very rapidly and I think if the vet would have treated him for parvo first, the delay may have cost him his life, so thanks again for putting so much informative info on your site.
Best regards, Annie

ANSWER and Comment on Vet 's Behavior:

Thanks for the kind words.

I would be careful about taking the 5 month old with you on your walks.
That's a long way. Wait until he is a year old. It's just not worth the risk

I get real tired of a lot of Vets. People think they are always right and too often - way too often - they are wrong. I would not use this vet again. Don't vaccinate this dog again. Read my article on Vaccinosis.

Vaccinosis

eBook

QUESTION on Dog that Died:

Hi Ed
I'm hoping you can help. My husband and I purchased a GS last Jan from a breeder in RI. He gets the puppies from Germany. This dog was so amazing.
We just loved him. Last week he passed away. He was just three weeks shy of his very first birthday. So very sad. He woke us up in the middle of the night sick. Throwing up but very little. We thought he might have ate something. He was sick most of the night and through out the morning. We went right to the vet when they opened and waited to see a doctor. They took some x-rays and saw nothing. Said his heart rate was fine. Said he might have ate something that didn't agree with him and it probably would just pass. Gave him the hydration sac and some pain med. You could tell he was tired and uncomfortable but he was still walking and drinking. Two hours later he took a turn for the worst. We could not get to the hospital quick enough. He went into cardiac arrest on the way. We still can not believe it. He was are life. The autopsy said that he had a twisted intestine. The vet said one end to the other. Nothing could have been done. Once it happens that is it. She said he hung on for a long time and was probably throwing up to try and reverse it. Please help me understand.
I can't find much info on the internet, our breeder is doubtful. Please tell me have you heard of this, how does it happen, is it in the bloodlines?
Thank you!
Anne

ANSWER:

Anne,

Before I got to the part of the email that explained the autopsy I knew it was a twisted bowel.

This vet missed it. In my opinion it's a case of an incompetent medical provider. It should have been the first thing they suspected and not the last. I would pass this email on to this vet and never use the vet again. They don't deserve your business.

I don't know what causes a twisted bowel and have never had one in my dogs but I know many who have.

I am sorry for your loss. I have a web page dedicated to people who have lost their dogs. You may find some comfort there.

Rainbow Bridge Poster

COMMENT on Vet Giving a Dog Prozac:

Hello Ed,

I am the Fidelco guide dog handler who wrote to you a few months ago thanking you for all the wonderful information on your web site. I have a story to tell you that you just won't believe!!

I have always enjoyed training dogs but I certainly don't consider myself to be an 'expert'. I was talking to a lady on an airliner a few weeks ago and she told me the most incredible story. She has a large dog that is uncontrollable when they come home from work. The dog jumps all over them and just goes nuts. (OK, here is the incredible part.) The lady took her dog to the vet and the vet gave it PROZAC!!!! Well, apparently this helped a little but the dog still got too excited when they came home, so the vet increased the dose! The dog also paced the house at night and was destructive. I asked the lady about their lifestyle. She and her husband work and the dog is alone during the day. I couldn't help but groan.

First I suggested that when they return home they ignore the dog. Don't greet it at all, no eye contact just walk past it and wait five minutes and then greet the dog when THEY decide to. This sets the pack order and the dog will react to them rather then the other way around. Second I suggested that they take the dog for a long walk every night. The dog needs exercise and it isn't getting it alone all day so it roams at night. If they can't do that then they should find another home for the dog. Oh I also suggested they FIND ANOTHER VET! Like I said, I am NOT an expert but I certainly know more then this vet! Have we become such a neurotic culture that we are now drugging our dogs to solve our problems?

See what I mean, I told you it was unbelievable!

Jody

QUESTION on Breeding Dog:

Hi, I have a shitzu bitch that is 15mnths old and is going to be in heat for the 3rd time in about a month, she is starting to mount her toys so I know it is coming. My vet told me a while ago that is I let her go onto heat the first time to plan to breed her or her chances of ovarian or uterin cancer are dramatically increased. Is this true? Also, is she too young to breed? I appreciate your feedback

Julie

ANSWER:

She is too young to breed. The earliest I have ever bred a dog is 18 months and most of the time its 24 months (and I have bred over 350 litters)... they are just not mature enough mentally or physically to deal with a litter. Find a new vet – the one you have is a fool. That was stupid advice from a medical person who needs more training because he lacks experience.

QUESTION:

Hello,

I found your web site. today by searching on hip dysplasia. We just found out that our 4 year old German Shepherd has shallow hips which has caused advanced arthritis in her hips. She has had 1 shot of Adequan, and the vet sent her home on Rimadyl, but I quit giving it because it seemed to make her worse. I have been looking for other alternatives to medications like Rimadyl, and I noticed that you carry Yucca. The vet says that we won’t need to give an oral supplement of glucosamine because that’s what Adequan is. I was wondering if you would recommend the Yucca in addition to the Adequan? Have you ever used a product that contains MSM, and would you recommend that? Are there any other supplements that you would recommend that would help to alleviate the arthritis pain?

Thank You,

Jennifer

ANSWER:

This is a stupid vet – find another one . The longer I am in dogs the more IDIOT vets I see. Rimadyl is a terrible drug – just use aspirin. Keep the dog THIN– you want to see a definition between loins and hips – SWIM the dog as much as possible, This muscles the legs up without stressing them.

If it were my dog I would be feeding an all-natural diet .

Raw Dog Food

COMMENT on Vet Advice:

Hey Ed,

I own Sheba, the female out of CJ and Snickers. I wanted to let you know she is doing very well. She's a quick learner, loves food and has incredible prey drive, and can't get bite my hands enough.

The reason for my email is that I just got back from the vet and almost everything they said contradicts what I've learned from you.

To start off, he called the raw food diet 'Garbage' and said that it would be 'taken off the shelves' in months. He said that pups can get salmonella and that its incurable if they do.

Also, I am going to Lake George, NY on a camping trip 4th of July weekend. I asked if they thought i should bring Sheba, they said its probably not a good idea, which it probably isn't because of diseases and so fourth..

I told them the only reason i really wanted to bring her is because i will be away for almost 5 days and didn't want to leave her home because i will be training in personal protection and only i could take her for walks or play or pet her.....

They said it would be a good idea to let others play with her so she doesn't grow up to bite people when she's older despite the fact that she's a working dog.

Do these people know what they're talking about or what??? I'm by no means an expert and have studied the 14 or so DVDs I bought from you closely, but as you said there's no way to learn everything on the first shot. I've watched a few DVDs 2-3 times and have taken notes, but what they told me doesn't add up.

I know you get a ton of emails so thanks for you time.

Sincerely,

Flu

QUESTION:

I have 5, 11wk old French Bulldog puppies. I found your site and raised them on your formula their mother got really sick and almost died. Mastitis. So she was in and out of Vets for weeks. I took my puppies in for their first shots and 4 days later they were all sick blowing fluid out of theirs nose and shaking there heads. Vomiting and sometimes diarrhea. This was three weeks ago. First my Vet put them on Clavamox drops. That didn't do it now Temaril-p and Baytril they have been on this for 3 weeks now and are not getting any better. In fact they are not having a good day today they are all really quite and have been sleeping most of the day not active at all......I am very worried about them and VERY stress out over this. I cant sell them sick either. Can you help me is there anything else that can be done for them besides meds vitamins something to help boost their immune system.........please help me I'm scared .. Thank You,

Shelley

ANSWER:

Tell your Vet I recommend a law suit against him and the manufacturer of the vaccine.

I am very serious about this. Unless people hold vets responsible nothing will change.

QUESTION:

Hello Ed,

I wanted to ask you a question about x-rays. I was talking to my Vet to get a estimate on my GSD 1 year old x-rays and he gave me a estimate that it will cost well over $600.00 to $700.00 to get it done for her and was naming off so many things that needs to do with my GSD and said that he would need to take at least 5 to 6 x-rays of her then send it off to a Radiology person to read the x-rays. Does my Vet really need to do allot of things to get a x-ray does on a dog to check for Hip Dysplasia.

ANSWER:

This is 100% BS. Find a new vet. We pay $85.00 for an X-ray.

This vet is a scam artist. Please pass this along.

Question:

Hello!

I was just looking at German Shepherd puppies when I decided to click on your Vaccinosis page. I read the whole thing from top to bottom and I can't tell you "Thank you" enough! I work for a vet, and he recommends that puppies get shots at 6, 8,12, and 16 weeks. I personally never saw the point in it! Last year, I got a Border Collie puppy in February that was 6 weeks old. I took him to the vet that I now currently work at when he was about 12 weeks to get him dewormed. He informed me that I was "WAY OVERDUE" to get him his DA2PP shots. I basically said, "Do whatever it is you feel you need to do." I had NO idea about the risks to vaccinating puppies! The day after his first shot, he was VERY lethargic. I though he was going to die. He would not eat, would not drink, was vomiting, his stool was runny... He was not a happy camper. I called the vet, and he said that he will be fine, he probably just ate something. He was not the hyper little Border Collie that I had for the 6 weeks before... I had a feeling it was because of the vaccination, so he did not get another one. Finally, after about 3 weeks of feeling like this, he started to get better. He was once again my happy puppy! He turned into an awesome dog... I swore I would never have another dog that wasn't a Border Collie... (And here I am looking at German Shepherds :) ) But a few months ago, he was not quite a year old, my collie died. Everyone thinks he got hit by a car, but he had no sign of trauma, and he just looked like he was sleeping under a tree... Not to mention, we live in a very rural area where there is not a lot of traffic, and he had over 180 acres to run on... It was not likely that he would choose a road... Do you have any ideas if something could have happened that late after the time he was vaccinated? Again, thank you for your article. I am never vaccinating another one of my dogs! It is nothing but a waste of time and money!

Thanks :)

Ed's Response:

Many times the reactions to vaccinations don’t show up until weeks, months and even years after vaccinations. So while I can't tell you why your dog died, I can recommend that you tell this vet I think he is a prostitute and he should pull his head out of his ass.

Question:

Thanks so much for responding. She is now constipated and still won't burp. She is not showing any signs of dehydration, but she is constipated. I think the antibiotic had something to do with it. The vet agreed with me and I have stopped giving it to her. I was feeding her the goats milk mixture on the Leerburg web site, but then got chastised by two of the vets at my vet office for using it and told to put the puppy on puppy replacement. They told me I should never feed any animal with another animals milk. So, I took her off the goats milk and put her on puppy replacement. The puppy replacement I'm using is in powdered form, so I have been adding more water just in case. She's gaining weight, but her stools are now very hard and it hurts for her to pass them. Any suggestions on what I can give her as a laxative? I read on another site about giving a constipated puppy Karo syrup to help. Any suggestions would be great. Thank you so very much.

Karrie

Cindy's Response:

What? Look at the ingredients for the puppy milk re placer the vets sell (which is crap by the way) Do you honestly think it’s dog milk??…. I never cease to be amazed at the stupidity of vets. Goat milk is the milk of choice when you need to supplement puppies.

Use our formula and add extra water. Karo syrup does nothing for constipation, it’s just sugar.

Question:

I got a call today from my vet. I had my dog vaccinated from rabbis about 2 weeks ago. The vet's office called today and said the vaccination they gave my dog had expired. They say their computer did not indicate the vaccination had expired and they mistakenly gave it to the dog. They are asking me to bring the dog back in so they can re-vaccinate for rabbis. I asked lady who called if this was harmful for my dog to be vaccinated so soon after the initial and she indicated it wasn't. Obviously, I am in no way asking you to be responsible for the health of my dog...but I am curious if you have ever ran into anything like this before.

Thanks again.
Mark

Ed's Response:

Your Vet is incompetent - find another vet and tell them why. If you love your dog the last thing you should do is re-vaccinate this dog. It is amazing this fool would suggest doing this. I have a section for STUPID VET ADVICE on my web site. I am going to add this to that web page.

The rabies vaccine causes a lot of Vaccinosis. Read the article on my web site.

Question:

Mr. Frawley-

I have been an avid reader of all your materials and discussion boards. I have also purchased videos and merchandise from you-obviously I respect and trust your guidance. I am hoping you might have a suggestion for me.

I have a 3 1/2 year old GSD. This dog has always been very active and has run with me on a daily basis. I started to notice a slight deviation in stride. It did get worse so he could barely put weight on his leg. I immediately took him to a highly respected vet hospital where they did an exam and x-rays. He has mild arthritic changes in his elbow (he is on Cosequin) and has some changes in his long bone (fuzzy areas). They diagnosed him (or suspected Pano).

I immediately checked his protein content in his food and put him on Deramaxx.

This has been going on in the same front leg for over a month without any improvement. Have you done any research on what works for this condition? I realize you are not a vet but with many years working with these animals I figured you may have some advice for me.

Any help would be greatly appreciated. I am anxious to get my dog feeling well again!

Kathryn

Answer:

I personally have never heard of a dog of 3 ½ getting pano. I may be wrong but I think your Vet is way way off base here. Pano is an issue dogs growing too fast – at 3 ½ the dog is already stopped growing. So this makes no sense.

There are a lot of things that can cause dogs to go lame – lymes, an injury etc etc. But at 3 ½ not pano. I would go to this vet – ask for copies of the x-rays and tell him you want to take the dog someplace else for a second opinion. If you have access to a veterinary college – take the dog there.

Kind Regards,
Ed

Another Question:

Mr Frawley-

Thank you so much for your thoughts. I have never heard of a dog Axel's age getting this disease so I was skeptical of the diagnosis-especially when there seems to be other disease processes that appear the same on x-ray.

I am also very skeptical because I have had my dog on natural dog food since I purchased him and it seems this helps eliminate the prospect.

We have Michigan State close by so I will take him there this week.

I truly appreciate your thoughts!

Kathryn

Answer:

Get your x-rays from this vet or they will make you redo new ones and that’s not cheap.

Please let me know what you find, I will find this interesting.

Kind Regards,
Ed

Thanks:

Thank you so much for your e-mail as it prompted me to get a third opinion. I took my dog to Michigan State Vet Hospital today-needless to say (as you predicted) my dog does not have Pano. He was misdiagnosed last week. The docs at State said they found NO evidence of Pano and his symptoms did not match.

I left my dog there and he will have surgery tomorrow. He has bilateral fragmented medial coronoid process (elbow dysphasia). The one elbow has a fragment in the joint...the other has not broken off yet. They said that by having surgery it will slow the degeneration process down some. We opted for this route as I would like him active for as long as possible. The CT scan made it look obvious!

I guess this shows how important elbow x-rays of imported dogs are. We put so much worry on the hips....

It amazes me because the original diagnosis was from one of the most reputable places in Michigan!

Again-I appreciate your e-mail as it gave me the extra info I needed and the shove that got me to our answer. It is rare that people with limited time like yourself actually cares enough to read e-mails and answer them!

Kathryn

I have a 4.5 month old rare breed puppy named Maija. She's a nordic spitz type and should attain an adult weight of 45-50lbs. I've had her for about 2 months, and I've seen 3 different vets so far. After reading your page on Vets, I thought I would share my experiences with you. First, a little info on my pup. She comes from a breeder who I believe is conscientious and dedicated to bettering the breed. The breeder provided me with a packet of info about caring for the pup, training, feeding, crating, etc. She included full pedigrees, OFA certifications and PRA testing results on both parents. Additionally, she gave me the vet records for the pup - basically everything from birth through microchipping and deworming was documented.

First Vet: The puppy got car sick on the way home and there was a healthy, wriggling round worm in the mess, so we stopped in the local vet's office for a dewormer. I tried to show the vet the pertinent info I had from my breeder re: deworming and vaccination, but the vet wouldn't even look at the info. She didn't mark anything in the file re: Maija's previous (albeit brief) medical history. Ok, so strike 1. While we were there, I asked a few questions about diet and vaccinations. The vet wanted to give the 7-way and rabies vaccine all together at 16 weeks. She told me the county required those vaccines to be administered at that time. I said, "really? I just called the county last week and they said rabies needs to be administered anytime in the first year." She stammered a bit and said, "it's just good practice to protect the puppy early. Afterall, you don't want your dog to die from something you could have prevented." I decided right then this wasn't the vet for me, but I was stuck there while she prepared the dewormer, so I asked about recommended diets. She told me Science Diet is the best thing I can feed my puppy b/c it's owned by a group of veterinarians. I said, "you do know Colgate-Palmolive owns Science Diet, right?" No, she insisted I was mistaken. There we have strike 3. Enter the Second Vet.

Second Vet: At 12 weeks, we found a different vet to administer the DP vaccine. The vet kept talking about dealing with Maija as a large breed puppy. I corrected him a few times to ensure he knew she is definitely NOT a large breed dog, but each time I did so the vet gave me that look - you know, the one that says, "oh, you poor, uninformed little person." Then we argued about vaccinating for Lepto. I didn't want it, he wanted to know why, I told him this breed reacts, he insisted I should just give her a benadryl shot along w/ the vaccine... It wasn't pretty. He wanted to give her the full adult shot, and I was very uncomfortable with it. I finally won the argument, sort of. I only wanted Distemper and Parvo, but they only have the combo shot, so we ended up with DHPP. He wore me down on the vaccination and I felt like an idiot. At least I held out on the lepto. The next issue centered on food. I am feeding Nature's Variety pre-made raw food. I didn't mention I was feeding raw, but he wanted to know what brand I'm using. He said he's never heard of them and they are therefore not a good company. He told me I should feed a big brand name diet from a grocery store b/c the big companies have vets on staff and scientific studies to back their products. I just smiled and left, wondering where I would find my next vet.

Third Vet: At 16 weeks, I went to yet another vet for the last DP vaccine. They were all set to give her the 7-way adult shot plus rabies, even though I was very specific on the phone that I did NOT want these vaccines. This vet was a little more reasonable about Lepto, but he still argued with me about it. He said he gives it to almost every dog he sees and never has a problem, but then he told me he treats a lot of cases of Lepto. I suggested his vaccine isn't protecting against all the strains in the area, and he finally just said it was my choice. He then launched into a lecture about my breeder doing me a disservice by suggesting I wait until at least 6 months of age before vaccinating for rabies, and that the internet is a terrible place for people to find information about vaccination, diet, and general pet care. He used that expression several times - so-and-so is doing you and your dog a terrible disservice... He was intent on giving Maija that rabies shot, but I held firm. Of course we wound up with DHPP again b/c they don't offer separate injections. This is contrary to what I was told on the phone. I am not delighted with the combo shots, but it was important to me that I get the distemper and parvo taken care of and I had yet to find anyone in my area who didn't do the combo shot. Needless to say, I left this vet wondering again where I would find the next one.

One final note on all three of these vets - I expressed to all of them that this is my first puppy and I am interested in showing her, which means I haven't yet made a decision about spaying her. They all told me I needed to spay her right away unless I felt ribbons and titles were more important than her health. I just can't get over the amount of guilt these folks lay on a person. I don't think there is anything wrong with taking a few months (or more) to decide if this dog is going to be a show dog. Many phone calls later, I found a holistic vet about 30 miles away. She recommends raw diets and titering dogs. I am glad I found her and we'll be visiting her for Maija's rabies shot in a couple of months. Hopefully this will be Maija's forever vet. I was getting pretty discouraged for a while. After all of this, I am wondering if you happen to have any articles on how to shop for a good vet? I tried asking questions on the phone, but the people who answer are basically clueless and/or tell you whatever you want to hear so they can book the appointment. It's very frustrating. I realize vets don't have time for free interview appts, so what is the best way to evaluate the practice and decide if you want this person to care for your pooch? I'm sorry this is so long - it's cathartic to be able to vent to someone who agrees that vets are not the holier-than-thou creatures they would have you believe they are. Between the guilt and the condescension coming from the vets, it's very difficult to feel confident I'm doing the right thing for my puppy.

Thanks,
Becky

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