i know that the best diet from all i have read is an all natural raw diet. i however have a problem. i have an autistic son and he will eat the raw meat. so, i can't have raw meat out for the dogs.

i have a 3 month old GSD. whenever she eats she will itch like mad. i have to get her off the dog food, period. since i can't feed raw and i will have to cook the meat, i can't give her bones. do i need to suppliment with calcium?

i also read about filling a kong toy with peanut butter or cream cheese. would this be regular store brand peanut butter, or all natural?

thanks for any help in advance,

millie

Hi! I understand your concern, but when I feed my dog raw, I just feed her in her crate. I let her out when she is done. It usually takes her 10 min tops to eat. I care for an 18 m/o boy, and have never had any trouble with him getting into her raw food.

Could you feed your dog in a seperate room (or garage)in a crate?

thanks for the reply <img src="http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

problem with crate, is son will open it and get the food. if i lock the door he will just find some other way to get in there. if he wants something he will take the crate apart. we also don't have anywhere we can lock the dogs up to feed them. sooo....

it's alway fun at my house <img src="http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Hi there, how about The Honest Kitchens Embark or Force?
Good food, no grain and looks like green oatmeal probably not very appealing to anyone but the dog.

Just a thought

Ahhh... gottcha! <img src="http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

I believe that there are some home cooked recipes in Dr. Richard Pitcairn's book "Natural Health for dogs and cats". One other option would be the "Honest Kitchen" (you can find it on the Leerburg website)line of dehydrated raw food. I believe that the meat they use is brought up to a temperature that will kill any bacteria that it may have.

 Quote:

i know that the best diet from all i have read is an all natural raw diet. i however have a problem. i have an autistic son and he will eat the raw meat. so, i can't have raw meat out for the dogs.

i have a 3 month old GSD. whenever she eats she will itch like mad. i have to get her off the dog food, period. since i can't feed raw and i will have to cook the meat, i can't give her bones. do i need to suppliment with calcium?.......

If you feed a homecooked diet (for any reason), it's crucial that the calcium-phosphorous ratio be maintained. I would use bone powder and eggshells for the calcium in a homecooked dog food.

There is a bigger picture here, though: 3 months is on the early edge of when food allergies usually manifest. Has the vet ruled out flea allergy (*much* more common) and environmental allergies (also more common)?

Before going the homecooked route, since, while I think it can be done well, it will never equal a raw diet with bones in suitability, I would see a canine dermatologist first.

While waiting for the appointment, I'd feed just some cooked hamburger and chicken and a few green vegetables and add some salmon oil and Vitamin E (none of which will be harmful to the child, especially if you pierce the E capsule and drizzle it over with the salmon oil so the child can't steal the whole capsule). This is all food that is fine for humans, including the fish oil, which you can get with the E at any natural food store.

This isn't a complete diet, but I think it's fine for a few days while you wait for a vet appointment. :>

Then, if you end up wanting cooked dogfood recipes, I have a few from the Pitcairn book and elsewhere. (Way back when, I was scared to feed raw but determined to stop feeding canned.......... before the internet and Ian Billinghurst) so I have spent more time than I want to admit cooking a dog's food. <img src="http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

All JMO! Good luck!

i took the pup in for her 2nd shots and her ears were a mess. the doc gave me steroids and her ears cleared up and she stopped itching. with her being so young i do not want to keep going this rout. he also told me to get her off puppy food and put her on lamb and rice dog food. i have done this. she is still itching, not quite as bad, but it's still there.

she doesn't have fleas. she does not have a rash that i can see. the skin on her stomach is not dry and flaky, and has a healthy look. i have been watching her really close to see if she is itching more outside, or inside. it doesn't matter. the only difference i can see is after a few hours of her meal she will slack up on the itching. i feed her and in a little bit she starts scratching and chewing.

yesterday i was working with her using treats (bad i know and have since cut them all out). the more treats she ate, the worse she itched.

my mom had a small dog that had very bad environmental allergies. she was so bad that the dew from the grass would make her swell and itch. i have been watching what the pup comes in contact with and so far i can't see anything environmental.

i am going to take her back to the vet tomorrow and let him see how she is doing. he was very concerned that she was already showing such allergies. to my knowledge no one else has had the problem with pups gotten from the people i got sam from.

thanks so much for the comments <img src="http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

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i took the pup in for her 2nd shots and her ears were a mess. the doc gave me steroids and her ears cleared up and she stopped itching. with her being so young i do not want to keep going this rout. he also told me to get her off puppy food and put her on lamb and rice dog food. .......

On this forum, if you "search" and use ALL FORUMS and expand the date range from a week to a couple of years, using the search words "itching" or "allergies" or "elimination diet" or similar, you'll come up with dozens of threads addressing this issue.

That is sad that the youth and the incidence of canine food allergies get earlier and greater, respectively. My personal opinion coincides with yours (and many other people's): Commercial grain-heavy dog foods do dogs no favor.

Those treats, as you already realize, have to go. But there are many single-ingredient treats (freeze-dried liver, dried chicken breast strips, human-grade buffalo or salmon mild jerky, pieces of the dog's food, etc.).

Lamb bit the dust as an elimination food long ago, because of its presence in so many foods in the past decade. It's no longer a "novel" (never-before-eaten) protein source for most dogs.

The dog doesn't have to "have fleas," btw, to have a flea allergy. I mention this even though Sam's problem does sound food-related, so others reading the thread will know that just one exposure can cause an allergic dog to react all over.

And secondary ear infections are very (VERY) common with all canine allergies. It's a good thing to control allergies for many reasons, but also to limit the use of steroids. They are a magic bullet, but the long-term side effects can be bad indeed.

http://www.thepetcenter.com/gen/itch.html

Here's a quote from http://www.pets1st.com/Articles/00112MGrabner008CanineHealthNutrition.asp

QUOTE: To definitely diagnose food allergies, most veterinarians recommend a trial with an elimination diet - a diet that contains a protein and carbohydrate source the animal has never been exposed to.

To start with, feed the elimination diet for a period of up to 16 weeks and monitor your dog's response. Signs should abate if your dog is indeed food-allergic. To get conclusive results from the trial, your dog should ingest nothing but the elimination diet and water. That means no treats, rawhide, or chewable medications. Following this strict regimen can be difficult, especially for those living in multi pet households. END QUOTE

This was why I brought up the ground beef and/or chicken* with some green vegetables (the allergen is generally a protein, including grain proteins and soy). Even better would be rabbit, buffalo, or another novel protein source. The big point is limited ingredients.

You are on a forum with a lot of allergy-savvy members, so please post back if these links and the "search" function don't give you what you need.

P.S. I examine my dogs' ears regularly for any beginning inflammation. It's much easier to nip it in the bud than to deal with the full-blown infection, and it's MUCH easier on the dog. Ear infections hurt.

Good luck!

*Just one would be a better elimination diet.

thanks all for the replies and advice <img src="http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

i took the puppy to the vet today. not only does she have allergies, but the vet is almost positive she has mange. she has one patch of hair missing behind her right, front elbo. her ears and stomach have just started to break out. it's no wonder the poor pup couldn't do anything but scratch.

we are going to treat her for the mange and i am changing her diet. i have read and read and thought and thought. with her being so young i am going to have to be careful with her diet. i am going to go raw and keep reading and educating myself on this. the vet said that the diet sounds like a good idea. i think he was impressed i was actually trying to learn about this. <img src="http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

my son lives to eat chicken. he has gone so far as to go in an oven to get the half cooked chicken out and started eating it. thank goodness he wasn't burned and i haven't turned my back on a cooking chicken since. leg quarters, breast, and backs will be out of the question. i think i can get away with giving the necks. i am starting her out with ground turkey and making sure it is locked up so that he can't get into it while it is comming to room temp.

to be honest i can't afford the honest kitchen dog food, and the other expensive brands. especially if i can feed her and the other two dogs cheaper by doing it myself. it isn't that we can't afford to take care of our animals, the price for the food is just to high for us.

i think i can get dawg (our GSD mix) to switch to the raw diet without much problems. our little mix breed dog is 12 and i don't know if i can get her to eat it. she can be kinda picky. hopefully she will suprise me.

thanks again for all the advice and i have taken all of it to heart.

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....... i am going to go raw and keep reading and educating myself on this. the vet said that the diet sounds like a good idea. i think he was impressed i was actually trying to learn about this. <img src="http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />.....i think i can get away with giving the necks. i am starting her out with ground turkey and making sure it is locked up so that he can't get into it while it is comming to room temp. .......

Chicken necks are great, too, and I haven't met a dog who didn't like them. So you are going to use ground turkey and some chicken necks? You could include one or two green vegetables (or use baby food strained green beans or squash). As soon as the allergens are ID'd, I would start with salmon oil and vitamin E, both of which are anti-inflammation agents, and which should be given together for a dog.

In light of the fact that you are both switching to raw AND doing an elimination diet, you'll want to make it very simple and limited until you identify her allergens (which is a pain, but much cheaper than the skin or blood tests; also, I understand that mange can screw up the skin test).

Any chance of getting a more novel protein source than turkey/chicken? Rabbit, maybe?

If not, I still believe that fresh raw food will be much better than commercial food. I had a dog (Luna, who died in November of 2004) whose blood test showed a severe allergy to "poultry mix," a dog food term, but who was just fine with raw chicken. <img src="http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Good for you that you are doing this. It will be a challenge to keep your son away from the potentially sick-making raw meat, so I know you are undertaking it with your eyes open. <img src="http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> And also -- GOOD FOR YOUR VET!

PM me if you want with any questions about raw and/or supplements you might have. I've had more experience with controlling canine allergies than I ever wanted to have........

P.S. Check out my favorite Q and A page for raw beginners:
http://www.njboxers.com/faqs.htm