Interesting. Most of my dogs eat a lot of grass, and they are on grain free kibble too.

Mine ate tons of grass on kibble, and continues to do so on raw with the same amount of gusto. It's rather annoying because he gets almost obsessive about it.

Jo, I will be curious to know if Lucy continues to eat grass in the same quantities when she no longer has kibble in her diet. Will you post pack?

Yes, I will. I will document for a week, then post back. I need to do this in case she begins again. If she does, she needs to go back to vet for a tummy check re: Giardia.

Less than a week but I can't wait.
The night of the original post, her poop still looked like air bubbles had exploded in it. She still tried to eat grass.

The next day, for breakfast, THK, perfect form, and Digestive Enzymes. Tried to nibble prior to pooping. Poop had no "air bubble explosions".

After experimentation, her breakfast now consist of Enforce and Perfect Form (Thanks to someone on this board with an EPI dog for this suggestion)--no Digestive Enzymes as she does not appear to need them anymore and documentation showed she was trying to nibble grass. Eliminated the un-necessary enzymes and she was fine. Supper, Same as above, with Phycox JS and fish oil.

Observations: This morning was the first time no attempt at eating grass prior to pooping. She has slept most nights all night without needing out. The 2x times she needed to go out, she had gotten a drink prior to bed time. Up to this point, she always had to go out between 11-2AM to poop and try to eat grass.

Most of the week of no kibble, she nuzzles the grass but she is now receptive to nope, and she even checks herself.

Frothing at the mouth while walking--no more frothing when we walk.

Stamina--she is now able to walk 1.25 to 1.5 miles at her choice. I do make her stop at a mile to rest --we visit mom and dad-- then resume. She may want to walk farther, but physically she isn't ready for it.

Energy -- soooo much more. No more couch potato. This weekend she asked me 2x to take her for a walk -- that makes a total of 4 times instead of usual two (morning and evening). Good for her!

No gas or belching now. NO pacing or whining. She still has some issues with her tummy pre-poop like peristalsis (sp) bothers her, but I have hopes that will fade away.

I still blend the THK as I believe she has some intestinal damage from her very severe Giardia infection, and it does help her digest her food if it is blended into a "powdery" form. I find no left over veggies in her poop and she shows very little to no distress after eating. On the contrary, she now eats, finds a lovely quiet place, rolls over on her back, and snores.

Her attention span has improved greatly as has her "tolerance" to being touched and petted. She asks for attention now, and I do give it.

So, I have come to the conclusion kibble and any food like dehydrated and/or raw, is wrong. Hambone has even improved, so I am definitely on the bandwagon of no mixing.

Connie and others have always cautioned against it, and now I have proved it to myself they are right. So, anyone reading this, I am now a firm believer in NO kibble for dogs who eat other styles of food.

Now, my decision is to keep her on THK which means I will have to poach different meats for her as she cannot be on only one protein source. Once I get her to eat the meats, I can by the Embark, blend it and feed it to her also...thus improving her diet and saving me money also.

CONNIE and everyone else who posts about kibble and raw mixed! Thank you for your insights, your reasonable posts, and patience without judging.

PS. Just curious, how often do your dogs poop? Should I start a thread? I just need to get an idea of "normal" 3-6? 2-5? 1-8?
No one has discussed this yet, and I am surprised!

Edited by Jo Harker (08/02/2009 07:38 AM)
Edit reason: added a question

Too many enzymes (not sure what you were using) can cause the opposite effect...loose stools, etc. I had this problem with my EPI dog. She has it so mildly that she doesn't need enzymes when eating raw. We do use a supplement by B-Naturals called Digestion Blend that has some enzymes in it, but otherwise she is not on prescription strength enzymes.

This site has some good information on home cooking, if you are still interested. It is just a great site overall...one of my favorites!

http://www.dogaware.com/

Both of my dogs love to eat grass...the longer it is the better. However, they are are not obsessed with it like Lucy seems to be. Oh, and they poop 2-3 times a day. Usually once in the am and once in the pm, with an occasional odd time thrown in...since they go twice, the result is very small.

Thanks for the link. Lots of reading to do on that one...the kind of link I love.

Lucy goes several times a day~6 times, still. And, she may do this the rest of her life. The enzymes may be too much for now that she doesn't eat kibble. She does have problems with fat--too much and she has stinky, mucousy, loose stools, she doesn't digest the grains at all--even the oats in Keen that I blend up-- so she will be a grain free dog the rest of her life.

I think I will look into the Digest Blend and compare with the Perfect form. I do know I need to add probiotics (powdered), and Vitamin E. I noticed I didn't have those listed. (Need to make a board with supplements per meal on it so I can check off and make sure both are getting all they need),

Three times a day at the most? REALLY?

OH, and I meant buy Preference by THK to add different meats to it.

I give two supplements from B-Naturals...oops, actually three! I give Digestion Blend and Immune Blend at a half dose per the recommendation of Lew Olson, founder of the company. The newsletters on b-naturals site are also very good!

Digestion Blend
http://www.b-naturals.com/digestion-blend-16-oz-p-101

Immune Blend
http://www.b-naturals.com/bertes-immune-blend1-lb-p-17

Green Blend
http://www.b-naturals.com/green-blend1lb-p-9

 Quote: Jo Harker

The enzymes may be too much for now that she doesn't eat kibble. She does have problems with fat--too much and she has stinky, mucousy, loose stools, she doesn't digest the grains at all--even the oats in Keen that I blend up-- so she will be a grain free dog the rest of her life.

Same thing as my Grace!

 Quote: Jo Harker

I think I will look into the Digest Blend and compare with the Perfect form. I do know I need to add probiotics (powdered), and Vitamin E.

I personally prefer the DB over PF. It has probiotics in it also.

 Quote: Jo Harker

Three times a day at the most? REALLY?

99% of the time, it is two.

 Quote: Jo Harker

OH, and I meant buy Preference by THK to add different meats to it.

Have you tried purchasing ground RMBs at all? This makes a huge difference with Grace.

Haven't compared prices between ground RMB and THK. Right now, Lucy won't eat raw meat. She will eat poached. I am going to have to take it very slowly with her right now. Get her tummy settled, then slowly add the poached meat until she seems able to handle it, then a few pieces of raw and see where that goes.

Ironically, while she won't eat raw meat and bone, she will chew a rec bone. Haven't really figured that one out yet.

I will look into the supplements on b-naturals. Thanks!