In SAR tracking (not air scenting, we're planning on that after he's certified in on-lead tracking/trailing), what are the most effective ways to keep an enthusiastic tracker's enthusiasm level high?

I have a tracking dog that until pretty recently has always been a go-getter. Getting him to slow down so I don't break my leg, while working quickly, has always been a challenge. I'm used to being pulled through briar patches and stinging nettles and getting scratched up, even with all my protective clothing! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Lately, though, he has been less enthusiastic, and even stopped working partway through the problem the other day. I got him back on track, and he finished, but he has never stopped working before. My thoughts are that it could be the warmer weather, or that it's purely motivational.

Since I can't do anything about the weather, and he needs to be conditioned to work in the regional climate, any ideas on how to increase his motivation?

Since I can't edit my post, I'd just like to add that I am new to the idea of TTD, and it is my understanding that in TTD with police tracking, the motivation for the dog is the possibility of a fight at the end of the track. With SAR dogs, we want them to be friendly when they meet the person at the end, as these are often lost children, missing hikers, and alzheimer's patients.

My question is, in TTD, what would be an appropriate motivator in this case?

J Parker Wrote: My question is, in TTD, what would be an appropriate motivator in this case?

For SAR, Find a reward that what motivates your dog (i.e. a kong, ball, game of tug of war, food, praise and patting, etc.)and have him work for that. The question you need to ask yourself is what motivates your particular dog. My boys work for a Kong.

Both of the earlier posts on TTD are wrong. Every S&R dog should be trained in TTD - the goal of a S&R dog should be to find people. The goal should not be to fight someone at the end of the track or to find a kong or a ball or a bowl of food.

I hope that my writings have not mislead people to think that a dog has to fight at the end of a track. if that is the case then I need to change something I have written.


The best S&R dogs track because they have learned (through training) that there is always a person at the end of every track. They track for the love of the track and knowing that there is someone out there.

When a dog looses drive like the one mentioned in the earlie post the handler needs to ste back and think about the possible problems.

The first thing is to determine if the dogs nose is working. This can be easily solved by having a second person hold the dog and the handler runs off. If a dog will not track his own handler he can't smell. So it may be a medical problem.

When dealing with a dog that used to be a good tracker with high drive the handler also needs to consider "pain". Have the dogs hips, elbows and spine x-rayed. Have a complete medical check up by a competent vet.

Good trackers with good drive don't wake up one day and decide that from this day on they are not going to track. There is a reason and the handler needs to put some thought into whats going on.

Ed,
This is from your article, http://www.leerburg.com/ttd.htm.

"The motivator for TTD is the fact that from the very first day of training there is always a person at the end of the track. When a dog gets out of a squad and gets into his tracking harness he knows for sure there is someone out there for him to find. His motivator is the possibility of a fight at the end of the track.

Notice that I said "the possibility" of a fight. This does not mean that the dog is allowed to get a bite on every training track. It does mean that there will always be someone at the end of the track and occasionally that person will fight with the dog. This possibility of a fight is what keeps the tough dogs going when a lesser dog will tire and quit."

Also, this, from your Q & A:

"QUESTION:

Is it necessary to always give a bite at the end of every track in Tracking Through Drive (TTD)?

ANSWER:

This is something that is really misunderstood about TTD. Its not necessary to always give a bite at the end of every the track. The fact is that most of the RCMP tracks that have bites at the end are "prey bites" that involve little to no defense or stress. The concept is to put PEOPLE at the end of the track. I have used my kids and my kids friends. I will give them a ball or a hot dog or something that the dog really likes. The idea is to build drive and let him know there is always a PERSON out there to find.

If there was serious protection work at the end of every track there would be a concern of making a dog a little too aggressive for S&R work.

An exception to this rule is the specialty dogs that are used in HARD SURFACE TRACKING (in Holland and other European Countries) are dogs that have a superior genetic ability to track do not need people at the end of every track. These dogs have so much drive to track they will do it for toys."


Can you clarify this for me? It would seem that the major difference between FST and TTD is not the reward system, or whether or not treats or toys are used as a reward upon finding a live person, but rather, the way the dog tracks, and whether or not treats or toys are used ON the track, or instead of a live person. So, in other words, it's not whether or not treats or toys are used, but rather, HOW they are used......is that correct?

Not trying to tick you off here, just need a little clarification.

I agree with what Fred is trying to say. I have worked some sar dogs who just are not driven enough to continue a search on their own, nor with the aid of motivations, whether that be a person and ball, person and food or a bite. Two exceptional dogs worked for the love of tracking and air scenting any human scent out there. They are what I call self motivated. Early training using a person with food or ball is great at the end of each track for this, but the dog is later working from sheer drive and does not require any motivation at that point. You should see this self motivation kick in by 5-6 months of age (as long as your ground work for reward was practiced many times previous) Also, there is the chance that you have been accidently correcting your dog by the lead and causing him to give up, or maybe he is not self motivated at all??? Could you have been stopping his action by a previous correction??? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

Unless I am mistaken the original question was on S&R dogs not police dogs. Two different things.

Police dogs work for the possibility of a bite. S&R dogs do not. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that out.

If a dog in training will not track for a person, if it needs a ball or kong at the end of the track it would not make much of a service dog.

In Canada the RCMP will wash a dog out of their program if it does not track 3 or 4 days in a row (assuming its not a medical problem). Pet owners will not / cannot do this.

Civilians can afford to take additional time to train dogs that do not have the drive to pass selection testing for service dogs but it always comes back to haunt them in their work. Many can have some level of success but they will never be great S&R dogs.

Vomperle,
The first time this happened, it is possible that I might have stopped him. The track was a few hours old, and there was a steady breeze, which would have blown rafts quite a way downwind, and he did want to go downwind of the track quite a ways. I tried to keep him close to the track, thinking that he wasn't tracking, due to his distance from the track (my stupid mistake, probably) then when that failed, he simply went to the subject without following her trail....I think that since she was upwind, he knew where she was and didn't need to track her. The second time, I wanted to test him on a fresher track, to see what was happening, and he started heading uphill and into the wind halfway down the first leg. I followed him a short distance, but when it became clear that he was not tracking (and the subject had never gone that way, and was not hiding in that direction), I backed up. Once I backed up and got him back on the track, he finished it beautifully. But it did disturb me a great deal to see him stop working like that, and his start was not very enthusiastic, which also bothered me, as he is usually just rearin to go.
My disadvantage is that I am the only tracker in the county training for SAR at this time. The certified dogs on the dog team do area search. So, I'm kind of forging new territory on my own here, and need all the help I can get. I have a few resources available to me in the form of experienced tracking dog handlers who live several hours away, and I was hoping this forum would be another resource.

Ed,
Our SAR team is all volunteer. The local Sheriff's department does not have the resources to purchase and train dogs specifically for the task, but relies instead on volunteer dog-handler teams. There is a certification requirement, and any dog that is not capable of certification, naturally, will not make the team. The handler must also be a certified SAR member before they may test with their dog for canine SAR certification. SAR is taken very seriously by the people who do the job, paid and volunteer alike. We understand that lives are at stake. We simply are not given enough taxpayer money to pay people for SAR work, or to purchase dogs. As a matter of fact, if a SAR volunteer or dog/handler team is not up to the task, they will be dropped from the team, as we don't have the resources to support their training if they are not up to the job. It is up to me to train and certify, and even then, there is no guarantee that we will be a part of the dog team. We must be up to the job. As a civilian volunteer, I am expected to train with my dog, in addition to my own SAR training, at least twice weekly, all expenses paid by myself. To train for at least a year, paying all my own expenses, with no guarantee that we will certify or even be accepted, I must either be crazy or really love the work. I think it's the latter. Know that I take the work seriously, and if my dog doesn't make the cut, of course I'll be disappointed, but since lives are at stake, the ability to do the job is more important than my ego.

I started my tracking training with my dog doing FST, and we earned our AKC TD. He ran his test track at a full gallop, which was his style at that time. He only started slowing down slightly when I started aging his tracks. We applied to join the dog team, and are currently training to certify, with the help of the dog team; however, their expertise is in area search, not tracking. We always use live people, and train in realistic search conditions.

It's not important to me that my dog follow the exact track, what is important is finding the subject. If the dog cuts a corner or tracks 40 feet downwind of the track, that's OK by me, as long as he finds the subject. I have been operating under the understanding that this is "trailing" as opposed to "tracking", and is the preferred method for SAR tracking, area search/air scenting being the preferred method for SAR scent work in general.

So far, when my dog makes the find (which he has *never* failed to do), I have been rewarding him with praise and food. He is a very food-oriented dog. I started tapering off the food, thinking that simply making the find should be the reward. However, since we have only been training for SAR for three months (we've been tracking for 7 months), I'm thinking it may be too soon to eliminate food rewards, as we have at least another six months to nine months before we'll be ready for our certification test. I plan on using no food for the test. Perhaps this explains his lack of enthusiasm, that I'm tapering off the food too soon?

Anyway, it sounds like I'm already doing TTD, but without the benefit of knowing the RCMP training methods. Maybe I should buy that tape! I'll have to save up for it, though, but in the meantime, I still need to train......

I'm off for vacation and won't be back to this forum for over a week, but I'll be interested to read the responses when I return!

I have not done any CKC or AKC tracking, but I am suspecting that it is trained by dropping food along the track and having the dog learn to tag each foot print along the whole track (maybe that's just Schtuzhund style?) I know that the only way I could picture getting the results I want from Sar tracking is to allow the dog to use it's natual tracking style and match it to a cue word (track) teach the air scent and attach it to a word (search), for aggressive search I would use (find em) say for a building or vehicle search (parking lot full of cars).
I would not be slowing the dog on his line in early track training, but praising the use of step scenting as opposed to air scent, but never would I discourage that air scent during the tracking either. I just want the dog to learn the 3 different cues and understand each cue is a different action used by him/her. I know I'm making it sound very simple, but it should be that simple so the dog can work with strong drive at all times. The separation of cues will help your dog. Please let him learn the air scent so he knows the difference between what you are verbally asking from him. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

Actually, it is very simple. I'm clear on that. That's not my question. When tracking, he wears a harness and a line, and I have a specific command. If he "air scents" while running the track, that is just fine, as he does know that he can put his nose to the ground if he needs to. I'm making the transition from FST style "tracking", to what is known as "trailing", which involves both tracking footsteps (neccessary when there is no longer any body odor, such as very old tracks) and "air scenting" (following airborne rafts, and/or rafts clinging to surrounding vegetation). Since I'm making a transition, I do have questions, and I *will* make mistakes, as in my example from my earlier post! I'm just hoping for some more specific advice on training methods, though now that I've been on vacation and have had some time to reflect, I have some ideas that I think will really help!

Thanks anyway for the feedback! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />