I have an 11 month old male neutered black lab. He is an indoor dog, crate trained, but has limited access around the house (I prefer not to have dog hair in my kitchen or bedrooms). He has a fenced in backyard and we even put in a run and a doghouse so when the weather breaks he can spend more time outside. We work during the day and the kids are in school so he is left alone from 8 am - 2:30 pm.....but we make up for it with loads of attention in the evenings...I would have to say the dog is a bit spoiled. He has been through basic and intermediate training. He knows the sit, stay, come, down, settle, off, leave it, no jump, shake paws...we even make him wait for food until he looks at us and we give him permission. He goes for walks and is not bothered by children running around or other dogs...he just walks along as happy as a clam. He's been to doggie day camp with no issues.

His days start out very happy go lucky, he is anxious to see everyone, he gets lots of pets and hugs, tail is always wagging...but his evenings, he gets grouchy. In December we kenneled him for 3 days over Christmas with the vet. When we brought him home that night he started growling when crated for bed. This was the first time this happened. He has a good size crate, plenty of room. If you try to pet him through the crate, he will growl at you. His body positioning is close to you but with his back and his head often turned away as if he wants to be left alone. Within days of coming back from being boarded he also showed signs of food guarding, he would growl if you approached his dish or if he was chewing on a marrow bone or antler. Eventually he started to growl when you approached him and he was laying down on his bed, not even in his crate...again as if he didn't want to be bothered. I should note that when he's eager to play though, he'll get up and be as friendly as ever with you...it seems like he growls when he wants you to just leave him alone and back off.

We took him to a behaviorist who observed him....he was well-behaved and very friendly with her. She said he appears to be a good dog but we need to control the situation so that he is not put in a position to growl. She recommended that when we put him to bed at night, we leave him alone, cover his crate with a blanket so we can't see him and he cant see us. If we needed to approach the crate do so with peanut butter or cheese on our palms so that he views us as positive. We did this and the growling in the crate stopped....but it's only because we are not creating the situation....the truth is if you approach his crate without food on your palm and he's not ready to get out of the crate, he'll still growl at you and I just don't want him growling.

She also recommended that we move his bed to a low traffic area in the house so if he wants to go lay down on his bed he can go and not be bothered. She said if he goes to his bed (which is not in his crate) we should leave him alone...it's far enough removed and he is telling us he wants to be left alone. We did this and for the most part if he is laying down we leave him alone. However the other night my 12 year old son was getting ready to go to bed and he wanted to pet the dog good night. I've warned my kids over and over that if they want to pet the dog and he is laying down not to approach him, but to go over to our staircase, sit down and call him to them....this way he's not protective of his sleeping area and if he came over to them, you can then read his body language (I will tell you that if he gets up and comes to you - he's friendly and eager to be petted or played with). On this occasion my son didn't listen and he went off to the dogs corner and was going to reach down to pet the dog good night and the dog growled and then sat up and barked at him. Scared the heck out of my son and scared the heck out of me because this is the first time he's actually gone beyond growling and barked. I don't think the behaviorist advice to leave him alone is really helpful at this point because if the situation occurs and someone approaches him, he's still growling (and now barking)....I don't want him to react that way and I don't want to worry about someone in my house who doesn't know how he responds to approach him and possibly get bit. Note, he's never bit anyone yet in a vicious manner outside of playful roughhousing where he might use teeth but not in a hard manner and we are very quick to tell him No and No teeth....

Finally food aggression....our behaviorist told us that if we give him a marrow bone to chew on....we've given it to him and we should not go over and try to take it away causing him to growl...we should let him go ahead and chew on it. She said in the pack environment if the pack leader allowed a lower level pack mate to have something it meant that he could have it and the pack leader did not go over and try to take it away.....we've been doing that and it seems to be better....I also control what I give him....I'm not giving him too many things that he gets overly possessive over...no rawhide, the marrow bones are short term, once he licks the filling out, he doesn't care any more, and he has a kong...once the treat falls out he brings that ball back to you willingly. I'm just afraid that if he decides to settle down in a high traffic area and he's working on the marrow bone or kong and you walk by him, he might growl to protect the bone. You should know that he will let you hand feed him right out of his dog dish, in fact thats how we prefers to eat with you right there watching him and sometimes even feeding him, otherwise he wont always eat.

I've never used a prong or shock collar. When I walk him I use an easy walker and have good control over him (he's 94 lbs). I'm considering a prong or shock collar for the growling and every time he growls, telling him No (so he knows who is controlling the shock) and then using the collar. I don't know if this will work on growling. And I don't want him to turn on my son even more because he's getting shocked when my son approaches. He's growled at all of us (me, my husband, my 16 year old, and my 12 year old). He seems to dislike the 12 year old more than anyone else. I have to admit, the youngest son has a more aggressive personality himself, he's the one who runs through the house, who runs up and down the stairs, who talks the loudest, and seems to be the one always into mischief at home so my husband and I are usually correcting him more than anyone else and it's usually just bickering...pick up your coat, you didn't vacuum, clean up this, pick up your baseball gear, don't run in the house, so I don't know if the dog feeds off of that and is trying to establish rank above the 12 year old. The two do play together, they play fetch, they do the training tricks, the dog will come up to him when he's sitting down and lick him in the face, at the same time the two of them do play rough sometimes and it has resulted in my son either getting scratched or scraped with teeth when tugging on a ball or rope.......but when the dog is on his bed and wants to be left alone, it seems he growls the loudest at the 12 year old...and as I mentioned last time he sat up and barked.

I know that it's my responsibility to control this situation....the dog just needs to be taught and I want to fix this before he gets any worse. If it weren't for this situation he's a good dog, he doesn't bark or growl at my cleaning service when they come in weekly....he's playful, he knows his commands, I would really hate to have to find a new home for him if I can fix this but at the same time I want to make sure my son is safe and not risk any bites. I should also tell you that it's my 12 year old who gets home from school at 2:30 and lets the dog out. After being home alone the dog is anxious to see him and very happy and friendly...the growling occurs primarily in the evenings.

Another example, I brought my dog home after an exhausting day at doggie day camp. I sat down on the floor to pet him and be with him and I was talking to him...he walked over to me, sat down right next to me so that his shoulders were touching mine and then laid his head on my shoulders and then lap and then as he was laying there he started to growl...no teeth...just a growl. He was the one who approached me, laid down next to me and then started to growl....I'm not even sure if these are growls or moans or his way of communicating, but I don't really like it. My husband said he thought the dog didn't want me in that area because he wanted to sleep so he came over and growled and was trying to force me to move by laying so close to me.

If you could please offer me some input or even a resource to read up on this or if you think the prong or shock collar would work please let me know. I've had friends suggest the prong collar. I went to the behaviorist and feel like I've exhausted my options. I just don't want a dog that growls at his own family.

I'm going to leave most of this situation to the more experienced with this behavior, however I can tell you with no doubt what so ever using an ecollar to correct for growling is absolutley one of the worst ways to use this tool and could very possibly escalate the situation.

Have you spoken with the manager of the boarding facility to see what may have occurred while he was being boarded?


ETA: Welcome to the forum. I'm sure you'll get the help you need.

Welcome!

So he was kenneled away for a few days and is now resource-guarding?

I tend to be wordy too, but writing a book doesn't get more replies.

I'm going to try to address issue by issue (or help get it going that way).

Your behaviorist is right: Leave his food alone.

And give him the chewies and marrow bones in the crate and NOT in "high-traffic areas."

This part:
"In December we kenneled him for 3 days over Christmas with the vet. When we brought him home that night he started growling when crated for bed. This was the first time this happened. He has a good size crate, plenty of room. If you try to pet him through the crate, he will growl at you. His body positioning is close to you but with his back and his head often turned away as if he wants to be left alone. Within days of coming back from being boarded he also showed signs of food guarding, he would growl if you approached his dish or if he was chewing on a marrow bone or antler. Eventually he started to growl when you approached him and he was laying down on his bed, not even in his crate...again as if he didn't want to be bothered. I should note that when he's eager to play though, he'll get up and be as friendly as ever with you...it seems like he growls when he wants you to just leave him alone and back off" ....

.... might be partly (or even largely) cause and effect; his food, sleeping area, seclusion, sleep, whatever, might have been uncertain or threatened when he was kenneled. Like Barbara, I'd ask in a strictly fact-finding (not-confrontational) way about this.


"'I've never used a prong or shock collar. .... I'm considering a prong or shock collar for the growling and every time he growls, telling him No (so he knows who is controlling the shock) and then using the collar."

NO NO NO NO NO. This is a terrible idea and it was good that you asked. We've had threads about the bad results of this bad practice, including the dog viewing the child he's growling at as the cause.

Not only that, but you don't want a dog who used to growl as a warning and now has no warning system.


Let's go to the most important thing: growling at the child in the evening. Does the dog have HD or any other painful condition?

I think that your behaviorist is giving you many good pieces of advice. But if the dog has no pain/discomfort and if the food and treats and toys are never left out to be guarded (until he relearns that they are secure once given, and don't count the weeks for that, IMO), then I would learn what is triggering the evening growling.

Is there any chance of a video clip of the growling when he is lying by you after he chose to be there? (I understand this isn't the same as growling and barking to get away from his bed.) And is there any chance of a clip of that, too? (Please don't involve the child or any real test -- maybe his change of position and demeanor when someone gets a little closer to his crate.)

BTW, I don't allow anyone ever to reach through the wire of the crate.

I'm not saying that all of this is management, but some of it is.

Connie, do you think it would be more helpful for the behaviorist to observe the dog in his own home & environment?

 Quote: Barbara Schuler

... do you think it would be more helpful for the behaviorist to observe the dog in his own home & environment?

Oh, gosh, good catch! I didn't even grasp that.

Heck, yeah!

Connie has a really good point in the middle of her first post. I would definitely take him to the vet and have a thorough check.

Ninety four pounds at eleven months is extremely large for a lab, he's already almost fifteen pounds over the breed standard and he's not done growing. That weight is more along the lines of rottweiler for the age.

There is a posibility that he may be in pain. Does he ever limp? Suddenly stop when he runs? Does he seem more tired some days than others?

It might not even be hip dysplasia, Pano is a very painful condition as well.

I would go back and check out that kennel. Do they house strange dogs together or exercise them together? Are the kennels mesh in between? Is the floor cement and what kind of relief from that do they offer? Dogs can come up sore from cement floors. How large are the kennels? Size of exercise area and are they supervised while using it? Exercise schedule? Press them for an actual answer on that one. When I worked at a PetHotel each dog received "two 15 minute walks a day" along with whatever "30 minute private play times" the "pet parent" had paid for. In reality the walks were just long enough for the dog to go potty and then they were immediately taken back to their kennel. We simply didn't have enough play rooms to give everybody a 15 minute walk and still finish before 10pm. Those "30 minute play times" were mostly 10-15 minutes with a few exceptions. And they frequently took place in the maybe 8x10 area between the play rooms where the mops and poop buckets were while the high school age kennel worker yakked on their phone completely ignoring the dog.

He may have been put in bad situation and had a eureka moment that growling means whatever was happening stops.

The behaviorist's advice boils down to just managing the situation so he won't growl. Aggresion does have to be managed in the dogs daily life but there also has to be a plan in place for eliminating it. You should really try and get a better handle on what triggered it though first. It would be really unfair for the dog if it was in pain and it was treated as a behavioral problem.

First let me apologize for the book...I was lengthy probably out of panic...I want to ensure the growling does not escalate to biting to keep my kids safe, but I really love my dog. He's my first dog and I just didn't know what to do.

I did talk to the kennel after he was boarded (he was boarded with the vet - to make matters worse). They assured me nothing unusual happened and that my puppy was content the entire time. He did come back with a scratch on his nose which they said was from chewing on the wire kennel. Each dog has a 4x4 indoor connected to a 4x8 outdoor run. I thought he would be safe with my vet. My behaviorist suggested someone did something to him, he was next to an aggressive dog, or something really spooked him.
I never thought of pain and will have him checked out by a veterinarian. He's extremely active, runs and plays for hours, has shown no sign of limping, doesn't seem to tire, walks daily. Let's you pet him all over, although the growling is usually if you touch too much near his head especially under the chin. He growled yesterday, but afterwards I noticed his chin might have been sore from mouthing at doggie daycamp.

I don't pick up his toys and keep them secure and I will start doing that so that he is not guarding and I won't use a prong or shock collar, that's why I asked first.

Thanks for all your input.

 Quote: Barbara Yusko

I never thought of pain and will have him checked out by a veterinarian. He's extremely active, runs and plays for hours, has shown no sign of limping, doesn't seem to tire, walks daily. Let's you pet him all over, although the growling is usually if you touch too much near his head especially under the chin. He growled yesterday, but afterwards I noticed his chin might have been sore from mouthing at doggie daycamp.

I don't pick up his toys and keep them secure and I will start doing that so that he is not guarding and I won't use a prong or shock collar, that's why I asked first.

Thanks for all your input.

And you are certain that there was no growling happening before he was boarded?

What sort of structured exercise does he get? Do you walk him or play fetch with him? Are your sons involved in his exercise routine at all?

Consider buying the DVD sold here, Pack Structure for the Family Pet. It lays out very nicely how to implement good pack structure. Here's a link:
http://leerburg.com/308.htm

And welcome!

You might want to consider stoppiJng the day care until this is worked out just in case something there is also playing a part...