neighbour as inavoidable trigger
#399001 - 08/28/2015 08:23 AM |
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I'm a bit confused about this term. One of my Pits reacts on people, but not in a aggressive way. Most people here (Bahia, Brazil) avoid meating a Pit anyway. But there are sometimes others, who do not have such big prejudices against this race.
My problem now is, that Slippie loves people and begins to pull towards them with all her force (39kg), especially if they speak to her or make any sign of approachment. Are these persons now triggers or not?
And what can I do in such situations? I cannot observe the threshold, because these situations always happen in an imprevisivel manner. I do not allow her to drag me to that person, I remain like a post. Changing direction normally doesn't work because of her force. I normally try it with engagement, making her focus on me with interactions she likes and of course also rewarding. Often it works.
But when certain people appear, especially one neighbour, with whom she seems to be in love, then the greatest interaction and the biggest and best sausage cannot compete.
As it happens mostly unexpectedly I cannot not make a turnabout, before it is to late. I have nothing against her meeting him - nice guy - nor other people whom I know, but I don't want her to pull towards them.
I explained to that neighbour various times, why he should not approach, nor speak to her but ignore her completely and that she can come to him later, when she stopped dragging.
But every time when he appears I would have to repeat the whole editorial about the Contras and Whys and how to make a dog resist such a high attraction like him.
But then he takes it personally and even worse: he thinks we(!) are offending and frustrating the dog. He doesn't catch, why she shouldn't pull, if she wants so much to meet someone.
What can I do? The only method which remains seems to be avoiding that street temporarily. Or perhaps to invite some less attractive people to our house. But they are difficult to find, as most of those we know fear to offer themselves as a treat to a pitbull and the poor, fearless snd a bit less attractive rest doesn't not understand the Whys either.
“If you can keep your head when all around you are losing theirs, then you are a leader” – Rudyard Kipling |
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Re: neighbour as inavoidable trigger
[Re: Christina Stockinger ]
#399004 - 08/28/2015 11:49 AM |
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I'm a bit confused about this term. One of my Pits reacts on people, but not in a aggressive way. Most people here (Bahia, Brazil) avoid meating a Pit anyway. But there are sometimes others, who do not have such big prejudices against this race.
My problem now is, that Slippie loves people and begins to pull towards them with all her force (39kg), especially if they speak to her or make any sign of approachment. Are these persons now triggers or not?
And what can I do in such situations? I cannot observe the threshold, because these situations always happen in an imprevisivel manner. I do not allow her to drag me to that person, I remain like a post. Changing direction normally doesn't work because of her force. I normally try it with engagement, making her focus on me with interactions she likes and of course also rewarding. Often it works.
But when certain people appear, especially one neighbour, with whom she seems to be in love, then the greatest interaction and the biggest and best sausage cannot compete.
As it happens mostly unexpectedly I cannot not make a turnabout, before it is to late. I have nothing against her meeting him - nice guy - nor other people whom I know, but I don't want her to pull towards them.
I explained to that neighbour various times, why he should not approach, nor speak to her but ignore her completely and that she can come to him later, when she stopped dragging.
But every time when he appears I would have to repeat the whole editorial about the Contras and Whys and how to make a dog resist such a high attraction like him.
But then he takes it personally and even worse: he thinks we(!) are offending and frustrating the dog. He doesn't catch, why she shouldn't pull, if she wants so much to meet someone.
What can I do? The only method which remains seems to be avoiding that street temporarily. Or perhaps to invite some less attractive people to our house. But they are difficult to find, as most of those we know fear to offer themselves as a treat to a pitbull and the poor, fearless snd a bit less attractive rest doesn't not understand the Whys either.
"Know It All" SILLY dog-lovers are so difficult to convince about training techniques !!! That guy cares about "always being right" but he does NOT care about your dog doing right
Maybe try telling him that She MUST Learn not to pull toward people because those Who FEAR Her will hurt your dog and/or call the POLICE against you (to have her destroyed)
But if the man still ignores your request, then you should avoid meeting him at whatever cost, IMHO.
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Re: neighbour as inavoidable trigger
[Re: Christina Stockinger ]
#399005 - 08/28/2015 11:46 AM |
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Hi Christina
As an owner of a pack, with 2 of them being large bull breeds, I understand the problem with folks approaching your dog.
I have neighbours with a small child who has no concept of the rules around dogs, and despite my friendly warning that they shouldn't be approached, he will try to rush at them if he sees me out, so my solution is to walk them early in the morning before most normal people are up and about, I go to these lengths to avoid problems and to protect my dogs.
It is a pain in the butt, and shouldn't be necessary, but it may be you might have to consider the timing of your walks to avoid the issue, as your dog will be the victim of any misunderstanding with your neighbour, which is sad, but true.
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Re: neighbour as inavoidable trigger
[Re: Christina Stockinger ]
#399006 - 08/28/2015 01:27 PM |
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Thanks Tracey for your answer and your adorable picture!
Sorry if I did not explain my situation clearly enough. To avoid misunderstanings: I do understand people, who fear Pits. I even agree with them, to be cautious with dogs of every breed, if they don't know them very well, even if it were "only" a Mini-Poodle. With children of course we have to be especially prudent, I fully agrree with your opinion.
This is not what I tried to write about. I will always respect every person with fear, I even think it is better to be with some fear in various cases, because fear is also a protection. Even if an owner says, "everything ok" people can never know, if this perhaps is a misjudgement of the owner himself.
My problem is not one of those really dangerous ones, as I myself am very careful and aware of such situations. First of all I do not allow children to come near, unless I know those children very well.
I also walk my dogs very early. I get up at 3am and begin my walk at 4pm the latest. I have to admit I don't do this simply because of a possible danger, but because of the heat, which can be awful especially in summertime.
Additionally I never walk my whole pack together, always just one at a time. I alternate this every day, one day Slippie is the first one and so on. The last one will already walk in the first heat as well as I. I walk them separately, because I know my limits. There are such a lot of strays around here and worse: It could happen that a really aggressive dog turns up, who bolted out, but normally lives within four walls as "protection"-dog, untrained, aggressive because of frustration. Imagine if I were with my whole pack, 2 of them Pits, I would not be able to master all of them. So only one, whom I can control, (although without 100% garantee if one of them were attacked, which is though unprobable, but not impossible).
If I go outside with my dogs I want to socialize them, train them to behave in different areas. This doesn't mean allow them at each moment to go where they want or do what they want. But in situations as I described it is very difficult to avoid their pulling on the leash. It's all about this.
When I wrote about that neighbour, who is by the way a good friend of us and has no problem with Slippie, I wanted to say that it is "merely" a training issue. If I'd allow Slippie to go to him, she'd lay on her back full of joy to be caressed by him. I do not want to allow this in this manner.
I don't want her to pull, and in order to achieve this, I cannot allow people to lure her to come to them. This is the problem here for me. People don't understand that we want to train our dogs and that we want them to behave. The fearful people actually are not the problem, on the contrary. The ones who don't get the idea why I don't allow them everything they are the ones who hinder me to a certain point to keep a dog from pulling. Slippie walks very nicely on a loose leash,(with these exceptions) she never tried to threaten anyone. I could let her off leash (what I never do for various reasons) and she would go to everyone who talks to her in order to be caressed.
Thank you for your opinion, Tracey, and forgive me if I have created a misunderstanding, probably at least partly because of the language barrier. In what you are saying you are without doubt perfectly right. We have to educate our dogs with love but not without rules.
“If you can keep your head when all around you are losing theirs, then you are a leader” – Rudyard Kipling |
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Re: neighbour as inavoidable trigger
[Re: Christina Stockinger ]
#399011 - 08/28/2015 11:13 PM |
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Tracey hit the nail on the head.
Until you've built up better control over the dog with easier distractions the neighbor presents way to much for the dog to handle.
Avoid him until the tile the dog is ready for that high end distraction.
It may be very hard to do but it's a necessity if you expect to get a handle on the issue.
If your neighbor's feeling get hurt you simply have to ask yourself what is more important. The neighbors excessive attention and even his feelings OR your necessity for control and compliance from your dog
old dogs LOVE to learn new tricks |
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Re: neighbour as inavoidable trigger
[Re: Christina Stockinger ]
#399014 - 08/29/2015 06:06 AM |
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Then it is everything clear for me. For the time being the neighbour is far to great a distraction. If he cannot understand and respect what I explained him, I have to decide for controling the dog. You're absolutely right. I will avoid him as far as possible, when with one of my dogs.
Slippie is used to some distractions. When I go to the little harbour in my town in the very early morning there is not yet a big bustle, but some fishermen and streetworkers walking about, who are mostly ignoring her, there she can master her curiosity and does not pull. I think I will have to work starting from this level of distraction.
Thanks a lot!
“If you can keep your head when all around you are losing theirs, then you are a leader” – Rudyard Kipling |
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Re: neighbour as inavoidable trigger
[Re: Christina Stockinger ]
#399016 - 08/29/2015 11:17 PM |
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Use the markers when she concentrates on you then mark and reward for that attention.
If you can work close enough for the dog to see the distraction but not get excited by them, that's good.
Over time just gradually work closer to those distractions.
If the dog starts showing interest again then you've moved to quickly.
If not then work a little closer.
old dogs LOVE to learn new tricks |
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Re: neighbour as inavoidable trigger
[Re: Christina Stockinger ]
#399018 - 08/30/2015 06:39 AM |
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Question 1:
I had some success doing this with my Lab-Mix. She got crazy, when she saw horses on a certain spot. I then increased the distance until a point, where she could see the horses but didn't bark nor pull. Within one week I could approach them until the fence and she sniffed at one of them without the slightest sign of excitement. Was this now correct or not to allow her to sniff at the horse or should I just have passed by?
When I met on another day the same horses, walking free on the street, she got very excited again. Because the whole thing was another picture for her?
Question 2:
With Slippie I'm also trying as you explained. But there are too many impredictable events here. Today I was walking in a normally more or less quiet road, when suddely someone opened an automatic door. The noise frightened her, although she is accustomed to it from our own door. Different picture again?
Same thing with a free running dog, whom she knows well and doesn't react any more. But today he had a Vet Collar around his neck and she started pulling again. I had to change direction, but ten minutes later we met him again. Mark and reward for attention, yes. Engagement yes. But again, the distraction level is too high in such cases.
This is the biggest problem here. You can never know, what will turn up. How prepare her for this? I cannot avoid such adventures, it can happen wherever I go. If I wanted to avoid, I would have to stay within my four walls for ever.
“If you can keep your head when all around you are losing theirs, then you are a leader” – Rudyard Kipling |
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Re: neighbour as inavoidable trigger
[Re: Candi Campbell ]
#399019 - 08/30/2015 06:53 AM |
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Hi Candi,
I fully agree with you. I've given up trying to convince him, especially not when I have dog on the leash. Then I have first to concentrate myself on the dog. He was upset about this and about the fact that I now avoid his street. He meanwhile calmed down, but still doesn't understand. We still meet each other, because he is a good friend, but I insist - without the presence of a dog.
Thanks for answering!
“If you can keep your head when all around you are losing theirs, then you are a leader” – Rudyard Kipling |
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Re: neighbour as inavoidable trigger
[Re: Bob Scott ]
#399020 - 08/30/2015 03:30 PM |
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Reg: 01-23-2015
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Loc: Brazil, Bahia
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Use the markers when she concentrates on you then mark and reward for that attention.
If you can work close enough for the dog to see the distraction but not get excited by them, that's good.
Over time just gradually work closer to those distractions.
If the dog starts showing interest again then you've moved to quickly.
If not then work a little closer.
“If you can keep your head when all around you are losing theirs, then you are a leader” – Rudyard Kipling |
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