What do you use? Harry values treats, so marker training is a cinch. But in retrieve, the food is too exciting for him to think. Give him the task, minus the treat, and the retrieve is almost perfect.
I started rewarding drop it with a treat, because he went snarky in a bully stick. I gave him it. And he had plopped it on my foot after a few minutes, and when I moved him off it. He snarled and stood over my foot and the stick.
I now give him the stick and leave him be, and than when it is time to put it away, tell him to drop it, Mark, reward. I do this a few times during his time with the stick, giving him plenty if time to get into the chew, but now, when he has the stick, and keeps giving it to me. I find his drive for marker training is so based on the reward, that he never shuts off and relaxes.
He has the same way on walks, I mark and reward every yuck, so now, rather than exploring and enjoying his walk, his focus is on only me . I feel i am taking the puppy part of him away, as he isn't just settling into the groove, yet we are only doing the training in short bursts, every few hrs.
I know when I post, my posts seem everywhere, so to recap, am I taking away his puppy fun, when he is so focused on me waiting for rewards, that I will have a Velcro Dog? He already follows me everywhere, and will abandon a bed full of chews to lay at my feet in another room, outdoors he prances on walks and shoved my hand, yes, he is to enough to reach it now. 21inches high now. He doesn't focus on the surroundings until a car passes. Than I am quickly abandoned until I switch directions. I will see have to save some treats for cars, as he barks and tries to follow.

I apologize for the grammar. I cannot get used to a touch screen.
So to end that prev jumble, how do you teach them when the training is done, without crating. I know on a previous thread Connie had said she gives a release, but I find he is listening to my voice, as a great, we are working, and even if I just stand somewhere on a walk, and pay him no attention, the little fart is sitting at my feet, waiting for the next command rather than being an exploring playful pup.
Unless I have it wrong, and this is him, ready, willing and able, forever. In that case, glad my bait bag arrived, as he is always good to go.

I just used a simple "ok" for a finish, many use "done".

The word you use is much less important then being consistent with whatever word you use.

It shouldn't take him long to figure that out if you say it and walk away.

The bully stick is more about food to him and that can bring out the "snarky" much easier then a toy.

The Ellis video about leash work addresses staying with you when on lead.

The is a big difference between walking on a loose lead and being in heel with constant focus.

Working him in a constant state of focus on your walks will certainly wear out the both of you eventually.

It's just to much time on, well, time.

Walks can still be enjoyable without asking for constant focus.

The problem is I am not asking, he is giving the focus. When I end I say lets go and walk on, but he stays focused for the duration of the walk.
I have not even started on loose leash, he just stays so focused on my face and hands through the walk, that he is not enjoying the walk. My fault, as I had marker trained him during walks, now I have to correct what I did and maybe make walks longer with focus on me only on distractions, such as cars or passing snowmobiles.
I am not asking for his focus, he is just constantly giving it. And I see that leading to separation anxiety, as when tethered to Jim, he will whine to get back to me.

A behavior ignored will fade away if not corrected or rewarded.

Just an old saying in dog training that could easily apply for you.

Sounds crazy but when just out walking you just ignore the strong focus. Make occasional stops just to let him explore a bit.

On your terms of course.

If he looks away don't correct or try and get back the attention.

Going for a walk is NOT a formal competition heel so don't look at it as such.

I use "foose" when I want competition accuracy and "with me" for a casual walk. That means he can walk on side of me as long as he stays within 2-3 ft.

They don't connect the two simply because it's two different commands expecting two different behaviors.

Same with "here" and "Front".

"Here" means come over to me but you don't need to be formal about it.

"Front" means I want competition form coming straight to me with a formal straight sit right in front of me.

It really sounds like you off to a great start with your pup.

Just relax and enjoy it.

Thanks Bob. I decided to save the marker training for home, and for cars.
I am limited right now, as I crossed paths with 3 wolves yest, so for now, small amount of treats in my pocket in case a car passes, and I just give him 6 ft attached to my belt. I don't plan on teaching a heel til spring, when things get gunky here.
We also have a distemper outbreak, thankfully he got his 3rd shot, it is foxes spreading it, so it might be a good thing his focus is on me, as there is fox crap every where. That means I now walk with a loaded 303, in case those wolves contracted it too, we had a few foxes in town attack dogs and 2 people, so I plan on just walking and watching, and he can just keep up and enjoy it as he wants!
I really can't complain, as he is housebroken, and not a huge brat for being only 15 weeks. That and he knows down, sit, come here, shake both paws, off, yuck and more! And zero furniture has been chewed. I am currently working on getting him to nap outside the crate. Bonus too is, he sleeps all night. I wake him at 11 for his last potty, but otherwise he is dead to the world from 8:30pm til 7am, than goes back to sleep til 8:45, when I wake him for breakfast.
He still gets bitey when he gets groomed, but I coat my hands in bitter apple, so he doesn't bother after a first attempt on fighting face grooming.
Oh, and I moved him to the prong. He self steers with the walks, and I don't have to worry about him choking on the flat collar.

And if anyone wants a great treat, this Himalayan dog treats are awesome, one has lasted him from Dec til mow, and they are odor free and stain free! I bought 3lbs from amazon!

I've been through distemper and rabies outbreaks when I was doing earth work with my terriers so I do understand your concerns.

Hopefully those big, white teddy bears are out on the ice this time of year.

The sit, down, stay, etc with markers are pretty much static exercises so they can be worked on in the house or any small area so don''t give up on them because of limited places to train.

Getting those basics down will help both the dog and you understand the workings of markers and that will be HUGE when it comes time to get back in the outdoors.

Any questions on training are always welcome here at LB.

As always, you are awesome Bob!

Thanks but LB is the awesome one for having this excellent forum for us.

It is..also great for Benton! I had to put trail cams in my yard, diff neighbor letting her dog walk into my acreage and urinate on my machines, with a not fully vaccinated pup, I am ready to leave some tidbits for the bigger. Cameras will hopefully deter her..
We have so many foxes now, I had a trapper set a box in the yard, he got 4 the first week, 3 are being stubborn. He gets to keep the skins for his service, as the foxes are it ating and crapping on Harry's potty spots. I may have to put up the big pen, hoping not to. Going to buy myself a 410, and rid myself of the buggers myself. Here they tease dogs.
And yup Bob, bears are on the ice..too bad the wolverines don't follow! Or the wolves for that matter!