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OK, let's try this:

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2) A mixture of dog breeds being trained ( different dog breeds require a different "touch" for training, and breed diversity in a club makes for better handlers, trainers, and decoys )
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4) A decent training decoy ( or two! ) that is able to train in both prey and defense ( I'd rather have a skilled training decoy that can work dogs than a good trial decoy that is not as good for training.. )

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Thanks Will,

All were great recommendations, but I think these two are particularly well said. Very often a trainer/decoy is very good with one breed and one type of dog within that breed and their success may not translate well to other breeds or other types of dogs.

You even see other trainers who might be excellent at a particular stage of development or age of dog, but that doesn't translate to all ages and stages. I've met at least one Schutzhund trainer who is incredible at polishing up a more mature dog, but not that interested in the early development work.

The other point is excellent as well. A good trial helper or decoy isn't necessarily the guy you want training your dog. Foundation work is like putting a wall together brick by brick, and not all trial helpers have the knowledge to do that or even care to do that.

cheers,

Alan...

well, i learned a lot yesterday (plus got a sunburned face <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />. the club sponsoring the trial is "new" (5 yrs), the TD has never titled a dog; no one in the club has.

after watching the TD do some helper work and the helper they hired for the trial--boy, even i could see the difference!! the TD just barely got the dogs fired up a little, while Nick R., had them fired up after 1 or 2 passes. he was quick, built frustration, then when he got a good bite, worked on calming while maintaining the grip. everyone there took a lesson.

also, there were some people there from the other club (a USA club) with their dogs. i spent a lot of time with some of these people (they seemed genuinely interested in me and the pup), and one of them pointed out to me that the sponsoring club's dogs were obssesively (sp?) focused on the equipment, ie, when the helper slipped the sleeve, the dogs were absolutely focused on it. when a GSD from the USA club was worked, when the sleeve was slipped, he glanced at it, then immediately focused on the helper again. this guy said it was because when they train, they train the dogs that the action is where the helper's at--not necessarily the equipment. this made sense to me.

the BH was educational also--saw some poor, fair, and excellent OB. the poor and fair was due to lack of focus on the handler. the judge was really good in her critiques, ponting out handler help, some of which the handlers were well aware of, some of which they weren't--learned there, too. i think that might be where taping training would be really helpful.

there were rotts, working-line GSD, show-line GSD, even a golden retriever. and, boy, was there ever a HUGE difference in the working-line vs show-line shepherds!!! it was obvious in the OB, and the protection work: show-line dogs bites were so much different than the working-lines, even i could see the difference.

all in all, a VERY educational day. i'll be going down in a couple of weeks to a training day at the USA club to check them out, etc. i'm leaning that way at the moment for 2 reasons: their people took a real interest in me (the only thing the sponsoring club's TD did was bring his 90-lb male over to meet my pup, which neither i nor Brix liked "he needs to be socialized to other dogs at his age"--how true is this?), and, their TD has evidently titled 10+ dogs, the members have titled dogs--just more experience there. we'll see...

oh--and Brix was interested in all the fuss & corruption, spent a lot of time sitting and observing everything. didn't get all wild and over-excited a bit, just watched everything, sucked up all the "puppy" attention. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

disclaimer: i don't mean to take anything away from the sponsoring club, at all. they were busy. but i think that as a complete newbie to this sport, both Brix and i will be better served going where the experience is--you don't give a 12 yr-old girl a 2 yr-old horse.

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......oh--and Brix was interested in all the fuss & corruption, spent a lot of time sitting and observing everything.......

I want to hear about the corruption, too!

I'm teasing you, Ann.

This was a very useful post. Good thread!

all the corruption went on in this one shed there, where there was a quite aggressive dog, so i didn't enter!

probably the most important thing i learned was, though i know a little bit about dogs in general, i have a WHOLE lot to learn about this sport; the fine details (where that devil hangs out), and the foundation seem to me to be the "make or break" parts. plus breeding, temperment, etc, etc...

BUT--it's gonna be a blast!

My number one priority is the quality of the helperwork, how experienced the helper is,and his attitiude, I don't like helpers with bad attitudes working my dog, I agree with Alan some helpers are excellent with puppies and groundwork while others finish and polish a dog off very well, some do both very well.
Then the distance, I have to travel, those two are really all I worry about.

Will said:

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8) A training director with several titles to his credit, and the motivation to pass their knowledge to members new to the sport ( it's karma, folks - we all started out as beginners and *someone* took the time to train all of us. Do the Sport a favor and do the same for someone just starting out, ok? )

I wanted to make the point that Will practices what he preaches on this one folks and has built up a lot of karma points since me and my dogs started stalking him <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />