I am not at home at the moment so can't check on a few things (book title etc). But, will try and answer some questions.
I went to several butchers before some would do what I was asking. I also live in an area that has a LOT of people who feed raw and thus potential buyers for the butcher. Your 'best' bet is to go to small family owned ones. These were the MOST accomodating for me. They were not sure about grinding chicken bones as they thought it would 'bung' up the grinder. They found if they did it when the meat was frozen it worked very well.
Ask the butchers what they do with the 'cuttings' from meat when they are doing cut/wrap work for individials/steaks/roats etc. Perhaps they already have a 'market' for this (mink farmers , zoos etc). If not, then are they throwing it out? Sending it to be processed? Usually, the cuttings are put into sterile large containers as they are working. They add the other organs to it and then grind it all, bag it and freeze it. Once it is frozen they take it and cut it into smaller amounts (usually 1 block is approx. 2-3 lbs.) I *think* they freeze it in a large bag and then take the bag off to cut it.
It sells here for approx 45-55 cents a lb. The chicken is more expenseive and sells for 89-99 cents /lb.
I don't worry too much about the 'fat' content of the meat as this is good for the dog and it usually is a pretty nice mixture of meat/organ/fat. What you DON'T want (had one butcher doing this) is have them put thier 'expired' meat into the mixture. Now this in and of itself is not the worst thing but they started to put in very strong sausage meat, very spicy meat etc. I will say that they one butcher I use is WAY better than the other. They have a very regular market of individuals that come and buy it and want to please us! I also use them to have my lamb/mutton done, so they know me pretty good. And I send them more buyers! I also feed 6 dogs and thus buy it regularly and in larger quantities.
For my other meat, I use a vareity of options. We are lucky enough to have several family owned raw food companies that cater to this demand. Thus they bring in the other meat (raw green tripe, buffalo, goat, lamb, fish, elk, moose, etc). I only buy the buffalo and tripe and fish from them, as I raise my own lamb/mutton. I will also buy some meat from grocery stores but this is mostly other organ meat (chicken hearts/liver, kidney, heat etc). Sometimes if they have a good deal on buffalo I will get it there. But, generally my meat comes from smaller butchers as I feel the quality is much better. ALL meat is human grade. "We" could eat it.
As far as grinding bones or serving them in bigger pieces. THis is really a personal preference thing. I always have 'old' dogs around and thus have mine ground. I will at times feed it in larger pieces but...) I do like to feed larger pieces of tripe for them as this is great for thier jaws, teeth etc BUT..only in the warmer months when they can have it outside...as it can STINK. I had one gsd that would still gulp the WHOLE big piece down. I kept thinking it would come back up but it never did. He always digested it but then raw tripe is FULL of digestive enzymes. This is what I wean my pups onto first.
I don't just feed muscle meat but my bones are ground in with the meat. As far as keeping the teeth clean, yes bones can help BUT, the reason dogs teeth are so white is due to an ezyme that is released into the mouth when they eat raw meat. This enzyme is very powerful and cleans out the mouth (thus the saying , a dogs kiss on a sore is healing). Bones, however, are very good for the jaw, muscles etc. Thus mine do get bones, just not the smaller chicken ones.
Yes, there is a HUGE differnce between raw green tripe vs the white bleached tripe you find at grocery stores. The white tripe is useless nutritionally, but it might give the jaws of the dog a good workout. Raw tripe is generally 'illegal' for butchers/stores to sell. It is not for human consumption thus they cannot sell it. So, most get it directly from the proccessing plant. HOWEVER, it comes in VERY large pieces (it is the stomach) and close to impossible to cut (bought it once like that). Many mink farmers (if there are any still around) used to feed this to mink. The conistency and color of tripe will vary depending on which stomach it comes from. Thus some will be more green (due to the digested/undigested grass etc in it) other will be more 'white'.
YOur best bet with tripe is to find a company that will ship it to you OR if you are really brave talk to processing plants to see if they will sell it to you.
Lots of people will feed chicken feet/pigs feet etc. I haven't done it. Can't see anyting 'too wrong' with it as long as it is not the 'staple' item. Pigs feet might be a bit fatty and rich?
Vegetables I use: carrots, beans, cucumbers, zucchini, green leaf lettuce, celery, yams (cooked if I feed them), garlic (minimal…usually 2-3 times a week and approx. 1/8 tsp. for each dog especially during flea season), fresh parsley (VERY minimal amount if I use it), apples, pears, kiwi, oranges, cantaloupe, melon, pineapple, and whatever is in season or on sale. I tend to stay away or use minimally the night shade veggies. I don’t necessarily use all these veggies all the time, but try to give my dogs a variety. I think it is important to not overuse a veggie/fruit, which is sometimes easy to do when certain ones are in season.
Other supplements I use:
Hokamix
Solid Gold Sea Meal
WOW WOW
Vetri Science Vitamin Supplement
And the list goes on….
Vitamin C Powder (this is given to all my
Pregnant bitches, older dogs, and young pups). I will use Calcium Ascorbate and then next time Ester C.
Live Culture bacteria through yogurt, or a powder *(can't remember the name of the one I use). I can also buy this in a squirt bottle form from my holistic vet.
Egg shells crushed
Omega Oil (usually a salmon oil but I will also try to alternate oils (hemp, olive) with a variety on the market.
A lot of what I supplement into their food will depend on the circumstances at the time (ie. being pregnant, sick, age etc). My dogs are very active, especially during certain times of the year. During these times their diet may change to meet the their ongoing physical requirements and needs.
I take the same approach with my 'extra/vit/minerals" that I feed. VARIETY. Thus I will may use a container of Hokamix and then next time use Sea Meal. I do this as each will again have varying amounts of vit/minerals...and I think variety is the key.
For vitamins that are fed separately (Vit C , E, glucosamine etc, I use the ones that I also take. Thus I talk to people at that health food store, read up on it and use the one that are most digestable and 'pure' etc.
I might vary these as well.
I am not a big fan of unflavored gelatin. If I remember correctly it has a lot of calcium in it...a big no no, espeically for growing puppies. I use capsules for Glucosamine(Praire Natural) and thus can open it and sprinkle on food. There is also a good product out called Recovery. This has a combination of things in it but is very good for arthritic dogs.
My vit c is always powder. My fish oil is bought in a large container that 'squirts' it out into the food. THus not capsules.
My philosophy on feeding once a day and fasting.
When I first switched over to raw it was at a time when FEW had heard of it and few if any vets supported it. I went to several lectures by a veternarian from Denmark who many people came to as a 'last resort' for thier dog and thier dogs problems/health. He bleieves that North America is doing the 'wrong' thing when it comes to bloat/torsion. He feels the only way to prevent it is by having a STRONG stomach muscle. To get a strong stomach muscle, one needs to do several things. First , feed raw food. He talked about how he could tell RIGHT away in a surgery on whether or not the dog was fed kibble vs raw by looking at the stomach. The other important factor in keeping the stomach muscle strong was to use it properly. He talked about looking at it like a balloon. When you fill the stomach up, it is like a full balloon. WHen the stomach is empty it goes down to a balloon without air. THis 'action' is what keeps the muscle strong...going large to small. When we feed several small meals a day the stomach never gets to it's full size, thus the muscle is never used /stretched to it's potential and cannot get strong. He actually advocates for feeding once very 2 days. LEt the dog eat as much as they want and then that is it for a couple of days. THis would likley mimic the real 'prey model' of eating as well. Although there may be some 'snacking' happening.
Fasting allows the body's energy to concnetrate on other organs and keeping them healthy. If there were health issues going on it allows the bodie's energies to now conentrate on healing. It gives the body an opportunity to completely empty itself of everything. No 'junk' left in the digestive tract to be causing problems etc. When we feed several times a day we NEVER allow this to happen. DOgs adjust fine to being fasted! Fasting is not new to people and there are many health benefits to doing it....I just don't have the will power to apply it to me...yet.
Shelley
Re: Raw food or Organic
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