Quote: Connie Sutherland

 Quote: Barbara Schuler

... Sonya, you are putting human emotions on an animal which has been bred for centuries to guard flocks of animals... How is your Aussie going to feel WHEN, not IF, but when this other dog gets hold of him?

I have much the same view of this, for all these dogs.

The stress for the Aussie and the Spaniel of living with the threat of the new dog is nothing to be viewed lightly, either.

This sounds bad to me: unfair to the dogs you already had and not the way you want your dogs to have to live, including the flock guardian going from being his own boss on patrol of acres of land, to living in an x-pen beside a herder.

I do have a 700 sized vari-kennel. This dog does NOT appear to be crate trained, I have put him in the crate a few times and it is absolute TORTURE (forcing his 100 lbs into the crate, then listening to him scream and claw for hours).

I reinforced the x-pen with a top and bottom grill, it contains him sufficiently. I have used crates heavily in the past but with the struggle to get him in a crate, and the endless whining I just do not see how a covered secure x-pen is THAT different from a crate (he did break out of it one time early on with all of us in the bedroom, that was before the dog aggression was this bad, no fight ensued).

If I leave the house I secure the aussie in a crate in a different room so no possible encounters are possible.

So here I am, my Aussie was not thrilled with the newcomer. The newcomer is not crazy about other male house dogs and is willing to settle the issue by killing them, and I have an unexpected female with puppies to care for and find homes for. We live in a frickin’ shoebox that is now mostly x-pens.



I'm not there... I don't have to deal with it, but is sounds like a living hell to me.

Sonya, if this is how you want to live YOUR life, so be it.

But the fact that you are willing to subject the other animals you collect, and I know your heart is in the right place - I really do - but subjecting them to this as a wonderful and appropriate way to live may not be in THEIR best interest.

 Quote: sonya anderson

... reinforced the x-pen with a top and bottom grill, it contains him sufficiently. I have used crates heavily in the past but with the struggle to get him in a crate, and the endless whining I just do not see how a covered secure x-pen is THAT different from a crate (he did break out of it one time early on with all of us in the bedroom, that was before the dog aggression was this bad ... ).

The dog aggression is increasing, then.

This isn't something I'd do to the dogs I have. You have their lives in danger, in your own words. You owe it to your dogs to correct this mistake (and to stop collecting dogs in what you termed a "shoebox that is now mostly x-pens," good intentions notwithstanding).


eta
This is not an e-collar situation, which I think was part of your O.P. on this thread.

 Quote: Sonya Anderson

........without the fence fighting (which honestly scares the heck out of me, if those dogs get into it the Aussie will be dead and I won't be able to stop it).

This is the last post I'll bother you with.

Your words show serious doubt in the situation and your abilities to control it.

You have admitted to fearing for your other dog's LIVES!

I just don't get how any excuses can be made.

Sonya,
The bonding issue is exactly why I wouldn't be willing to take on an Anatolian at a year old. Making it worse is that the dog was raised in it's, what one may call, it's proper environment; with a herd of bovines.
Okay you feel your family has been taken (accepted) by this dog. Okay.
Think about this scenario, the other dogs have to go, no no no they have to go, they are the enemy period. Now you have a pup, yes he is still a puppy. Just wait, it is going to get even worse with this dog in territorial possessive dominant behavior and on top of that they are bred for independence......that means not to take orders or directions, from anyone, much less a shaky hand.
I feel not only are you in over your head with this dog, but you could very well be putting your family and friends and any innocent passerby in danger. Real danger, not just dog bite danger. But maimed, perhaps life threatening danger.
These dogs are not for the guess and by golly crowd.
And some people feel they don't even belong among humans at all and they just should stay with the sheep.

I wish you luck, but my advice is to return the dog to the breeder. Everyone will be better off.

 Quote: barbara schuler

Sonya, if this is how you want to live YOUR life, so be it. But the fact that you are willing to subject the other animals you collect, and I know your heart is in the right place - I really do, but subjecting them to this as a wonderful and appropriate way to live may not be in THEIR best interest.

Okay first of all, I seriously doubt I am the ONLY person on this board that has multiple dogs, males or females, that have to be separated.

I know in the Doberman world it is QUITE common for people to have two or more males that can never, ever cross pathes in the same home. The average Doberman male will fight with another Dobie male on sight.

I have also read articles on this site in which Mr. Frawley refers to dog aggressive canines that have to be vigilantly separated in his own kennels.

Yet somehow everyone here is saying I must be some emotionally unbalanced "collector" of animals because I have ended up with two males that cannot cohabitate?

I do not hear ANYONE offering advice on how to help the situation, I only hear people saying "get rid of the Anatolian".

Is this a forum for advice or for judgement? I thought this was about training and behavior, this dog has been in my home for a couple of months, the dogs have NEVER been able to physically fight and I do not believe that this situation is "unsolvable".

Maybe it is "unsolveable" but even if that is the case I am sadly disappointed that NO ONE so far has offered any helpful suggestions, but has only sat in judgement and made off the cuff calls.

 Quote: sonya anderson

 Quote: barbara schuler

Sonya, if this is how you want to live YOUR life, so be it. But the fact that you are willing to subject the other animals you collect, and I know your heart is in the right place - I really do, but subjecting them to this as a wonderful and appropriate way to live may not be in THEIR best interest.

Okay first of all, I seriously doubt I am the ONLY person on this board that has multiple dogs, males or females, that have to be separated.

I know in the Doberman world it is QUITE common for people to have two or more males that can never, ever cross pathes in the same home. The average Doberman male will fight with another Dobie male on sight.

I have also read articles on this site in which Mr. Frawley refers to dog aggressive canines that have to be vigilantly separated in his own kennels.

Yet somehow everyone here is saying I must be some emotionally unbalanced "collector" of animals because I have ended up with two males that cannot cohabitate?

I do not hear ANYONE offering advice on how to help the situation, I only hear people saying "get rid of the Anatolian".

Is this a forum for advice or for judgement? I thought this was about training and behavior, this dog has been in my home for a couple of months, the dogs have NEVER been able to physically fight and I do not believe that this situation is "unsolvable".

Maybe it is "unsolveable" but even if that is the case I am sadly disappointed that NO ONE so far has offered any helpful suggestions, but has only sat in judgement and made off the cuff calls.

Judgment?

Telling you that you need to correct a mistake for the sake of all the dogs involved is not judgment. It was suggested after I asked in two posts about kennels and crates.

I sure hope you listen, because this is a thread we've seen the likes of more than once. When an instant solution isn't forthcoming, suddenly everything described becomes much less serious.

These are your words, not ours: the fence fighting (which honestly scares the heck out of me, if those dogs get into it the Aussie will be dead and I won't be able to stop it



"Okay first of all, I seriously doubt I am the ONLY person on this board that has multiple dogs, males or females, that have to be separated. I know in the Doberman world it is QUITE common for people to have two or more males that can never, ever cross pathes in the same home. The average Doberman male will fight with another Dobie male on sight. ... I have also read articles on this site in which Mr. Frawley refers to dog aggressive canines that have to be vigilantly separated in his own kennels."


Kennels. Not x-pens in the same room with fence-fighting, and no security for the dogs you already had.

"I seriously doubt I am the ONLY person on this board that has multiple dogs, males or females, that have to be separated."

Of course not. I'm included in the many here who have had such a situation.

But "separated" means something very different to me. It means "separated." As in no threats, no view of each other, no fence fighting, and no fear on my part that my dog will be killed by the new dog.

Sonya,

No. You have been given advice, but as I feared earlier, it was not going to be the type you hoped to hear, or the kind any of us wanted to offer.

What do WE have to gain by not giving you the advice which might help, if that advice was to set your e-collar at this level, zap the dog when he even began to look at the other dog, etc..???

We are still up at almost 1:00 AM trying to help someone we've never met but who obviously NEEDS help. It is just that the help you NEED is not the help you want to hear, and I understand that. That is why I warned to leave your ego at the door and try to listen.

You have one dog which from your first post on another thread is bred for protection of flocks and killing of canines,etc.. You came asking how to integrate THIS particular dog into your specific surroundings given your level of expertise (NO offense here, okay?) and our honest, heart-felt advice, is that perhaps you are in over your head and perhaps the Anatolian might not be right for you at this point in your life. NO judgement Sonya, just the advice and input you seek.

We would all be irresponsible to tell you anything else.