Quote: Westy Bell

the prong collar usually slides down closer to her chest, so I don't think she feels it much.

A correctly fitted prong collar shouldn't be sliding down the neck. Sounds like you need to take out a couple links.

 Quote: westy bell

... I am not sure why I keep being told about obedience training, I thought that is what I have been doing? We have been training her since we got her. She knows sit, down, wait, stay, hup, leave it, off, etc. She listens pretty well to those commands, we are just having problems with her interaction with the kids and accepting affection without trying to bite, those are the main ones, plus her separation anxiety and just basically being so hyper and over-excitable.

Because, QUOTE: "You are basically describing an untrained, high energy dog who is looking for an outlet for that pent up frustration. Add poor bite inhibition and you have a real problem, especially because you have small children."

She doesn't know those commands (or any commands) until she knows them much better than "pretty well." If she was really ob trained, the thread would be very short.

But I would truly say "start with exercise." You're putting yourself and the dog at an extreme disadvantage by letting her pile frustrated energy on top of frustrated energy.

Then daily basic ob and proofing.

I know it would be great to have a one-sentence answer, but it's really the same ol' same ol' that all but the most laid-back pups need.

I know you're overwhelmed. I'd probably focus first on managing the dog (including always having a drag line, or tether to you, on the dog) and getting the exercise in place.

 Quote: Lori Jacobs

 Quote: Westy Bell

the prong collar usually slides down closer to her chest, so I don't think she feels it much.

A correctly fitted prong collar shouldn't be sliding down the neck. Sounds like you need to take out a couple links.

http://leerburg.com/fit-prong.htm



PS

Raise your hands if you play tug with your pup .... whoops! I think just about every hand shot up.



Edited by Connie Sutherland (05/20/2011 08:24 PM)
Edit reason: PS

 Quote: dennis jones

 Quote: westy bell

I am steering away from the tugging game because of everything I've read on the internet about making sure I establish myself as pack leader, apparently tugging wars are detrimental to establishing that I am pack leader.

BS, tug games are great games to bond with and use as training device

Amen.

And your prong is fitted incorrectly. Please see the link in my previous post. There are also better ways to train a dog that giving a strong correction for something the dog doesn't know how to do. Try refitting your prong and letting her self correct. Then spend time teaching her to walk on a loose leash. Start simple at home with minimal distractions...progress to more challenging situations in terms of keeping her attention. Think of the prong as a tool to get her exercise in...

Still stand by my statement of more exercise and more obedience training.

More exercise will make her calmer and less excitable.

More obedience will make her listen to you and build a relationship of respect, not you trying to out "dominate" the "dominant" dog.

Some good reading for you:
http://leerburg.com/markers.htm

Some good videos for you:
http://leerburg.com/flix/searchResults.php?searchfor=engagement

Succinct and perfect.

 Quote: westy bell

Got it from here, Establishing and Keeping Alpha position: http://www.dogbreedinfo.com/topdogrules.htm

This list of "how to be your dog's boss" drives me crazy.

Especially:
"If you establish eye contact with the dog, the dog must avert his gaze first. If the human averts first this reinforces the dogs higher power position."

I have three dogs who all give me great eye contact...in fact, we've practiced it a lot. I don't participate in staring contests with my dog where I make them uncomfortable enough to avoid eye contact.

Quit reading these sites!

Hi Westy,
I haven't read this entire thread, but I can tell you that what you are describing sounds quite a bit like my female at that age.

You need to change your expectations a bit. This dog may never really like being petted. Some dogs don't, or they find it so stimulating that their response is to mouth you. That's an easy one. Stop petting her except when she's calm enough to accept that type of interaction.

Up her exercise and incorporate marker training into your daily schedule. Are you familiar with marker training? (again, I haven't read all of this thread, so I apologize if I'm asking questions that have already been asked)

re the prong collar, ditto that you need to get it fitted properly. It should be sitting just under the jaw line of the dog. Take a link or two out, or buy a quick release prong like the Herm Sprenger one sold here.

Keep her interactions with the kids very controlled. Teach them how to calmly interact with her. When she (or the kids) get too riled up, separate them. Don't allow roughhousing, especially inside the house.
Your 5 year old can join you in fetch or frisbee play, with you supervising. This is a great way for them to interact, IMO.

Your situation is managable, and it sounds like you have a nice pup.

Keeping them seperated just builds frustration for the dog. I'd let everybody go about their normal house activity and teach the dog the rules. Keep the leash on him and don't let him get away with unwanted behavior, he gets corrected, show him the behavior you want, then reward him, all in a row like that. Lunging and jumping are 2 different things, sounds like you may be frusrated and don't use the training opportunities that are presenting themselves on a daily basis! Show the dog how you want him to live in the house, don't expect him to just know. Take a video and post it, that would help.

If she knows "leave it", use it generously during a tug game - i.e: tug, tug, tug, leave it (dog lets go), sit (dog sits) YES!, gets to tug more as a reward.

There is no dominance struggle here, just playing, OB and exercise all mixed into one fun little bonding session with your dog.

I've got a zany pit-cross that sounds a lot like yours, Westy. And absolutely... forget the gym, take up jogging & work that pup's energy off! Does she like water? I can burn up a lot of my dog's energy w/a good session of water retrieving (she might need a flotation jacket... pits don't float too well).

My dog is very 'oral'... she had a full-mouth bite at 8 weeks & game? Yikes. Tug is definitely the way to go w/that. It supports your dominance, because you ultimately control the tug. My dog (70#) goes into a bliss state just hanging from the tug when she starts to wear out the manic energy. I can lift the front of her body off the ground & you can literally see her relax. Of course, I can't hold her up long, but then I can drag her... no joke. She just lays there while I slowly drag her w/the tug.

Some pits play by body slamming... I had two that would take opposite ends of the yard, run at each other top speed, leap into the air & body slam, fall to the ground w/the biggest $#it-eathing grins on their faces & then go do it again. Freaked the bejeesus out of my sheltie when they tried it with him.

Oh, and some of them play by dragging each other around by the cheek! Dear heavens...

Sometimes it's like living w/a 16-year old defensive lineman... LOL

I'm curious... was your previous dog a pit? My previous pups (setters, labs, pointers) had come from the retrieving group, so my second pit pup was a major surprise. The first one was a very soft dog, this one is a very hard dog.

A 2-YO is an awkward size... too big to pack around, too small to run much. And the pup isn't big enough to train to cart yet... Yep, devil & the deep blue sea.