I am a little disturbed by Mr. Frawley's podcasts. In his section on training, he delves into the 3 types of training as he sees them and constantly badgers "treat training" and "compulsion". However, he constantly mentions these methods in his "The Groundwork to Becoming Your Puppies Pack Leader". I agree that it is in the middle that trainers should lie, however, I find his article to be otherwise.

Also, Mr. Frawley constantly attempts to delve into the psyche of the dog without out citing any true textual basis. While it is true that a dog needs a master and needs his role defined, in true Darwinian models, the role of Alpha is constantly being challenged and reasserted. Otherwise, the species cannot evolve. The dog recognizes the master as the benevolent dictator but will, without doubt, challenge for Alpha status. We see this as the sudden "forgetfullness" that a well-trained dog might encounter.

I am not questioning Mr. Frawley's methods, I have no basis to do as such. However, what I am questioning is allowing someone to profess dogmatically that their approach is singular. For example, the idea of a puppy being constantly on lead until he "learns to be calm in the house", is ludicrous. The psyche of the puppy equates (in many ways) with that of a child, and children are energetic, mischievous beings. Stifling this behaviour creates dogs that "don’t look happy because they never know when the hammer is going to fall."

I hope this post will incite discussion on the above discrepancies and lead to a deeper understanding for us all. However, I also fear questioning the creators of the "Leerburg" brand and forum may find it easier to simply destroy this post.

"It is through constant questioning of the commmon knowledge that society progresses."

Ed's edited in comments

This individual is a TROLL - he registered under a false name - had he just registered as John Doe we would have spotted him quicker - it never stops amazing me how many wierd people there are in the world.

As far as his comment on keeping a puppy on line in the house not working - well he has a lot to learn about raising puppies and his lack of experience in trianing dogs is evident. This works in our home and we have well mannered house dogs with a ton of drive.

I see nothing wrong with your post, so I would doubt it would be "trashed".

Now, you mentioned that Mr. Frawley downs treat training, this is not true he mentions that people that BEG their animals to perform or just give in is wrong.

Also, I dog (or wolf) only challanges if it believes that the leader is no longer suitable to be a leader or feels it is strong enough to challenge. If you show yourself to be the leader the dog will not want to challnge you or assume the role of leader. Mr. Frawley mentions that the dog does NOT want to be the pack leader it wants a good leader in YOU.

Thank you.

Hey Daniel, you watched that wolf documentary on The Learning Channel didn't you <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Nope, Animal Planet!
But I subscribed to the Podcasts too. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

I gotta watch that doc. though, what it called.
Sorry for getting off topic.

 Quote:

I see nothing wrong with your post, so I would doubt it would be "trashed".

Now, you mentioned that Mr. Frawley downs treat training, this is not true he mentions that people that BEG their animals to perform or just give in is wrong.

Also, I dog (or wolf) only challanges if it believes that the leader is no longer suitable to be a leader or feels it is strong enough to challenge. If you show yourself to be the leader the dog will not want to challnge you or assume the role of leader. Mr. Frawley mentions that the dog does NOT want to be the pack leader it wants a good leader in YOU.

Thank you.

Well, Daniel, you beat everyone to it, and you did a pretty good job. You've been reading up!

Lol, yeah I have.

Daniel, Just giving you a hard time <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> I can't remember off hand what the title was. I'll find out.

Does anybody else have any takes on this subject?

 Quote:

Does anybody else have any takes on this subject?

You mean about the orignal post? I think readers here spotted that post as coming from someone with lots of extra time on his hands and nothing better to do than glance (superficially) at a couple of paragraphs and pretend that he knows a lot about dogs in order to start a fight. ...sigh...

Those weren't real questions and weren't worth any more time time than you took to answer them. JMO!