Quote: Alyssa Myracle

I doubt this is the problem, but a vet check to rule out any medical problems, would be a good call.

I thought about this as well, and then got to thinking about the age of the dog. But, it never hurts to check either.

Whenever my dogs do something that is WAY out of the ordinary more than a few times, we get a check up, especially if it is aggression based.

I truly think that going back to basics and re-establishing pack structure is going to help immensely.
Dogs really do need refresher courses at times since they are not programmable, only trainable. Hope that makes sense.

Yeah thanks people. Vet here we come. Im lucky got a South African and German vet at the practice who know rotts.
Buy new crate 2morrow for the house.
Still concerned, why the fear factor/spooked behaviour?

Andrew,

Some people believe that there are "fear periods" during certain stages of a growing pup and young dogs life. I would tend to agree as I have had dogs do this, however I do not think it happens with all dogs.
This may be what is going on with your boy.

Just make sure everything stays positive for him and do not throw too much new stuff at him during this period.
As far as how long it lasts, I would have to sat that it depends on the dog.

I wrote about this in my own post, but brief synopsis is my g.s. does this kind of thing also. It is confusing. He'll come over to be pet (usually by the s.o.) and he'll appear to be enjoying the petting, then this look comes over him that says he's suddenly not ok with the petting any longer. Soon after, the growl, and if petting continues, a bite. We've tried calling him to us, making him do something, but that didn't help. People here suggested keeping petting to a minimum, and don't put the dog in a sit/ down (any position it knows it needs to hold until released) so he doesn't feel cornered and he can just walk away when he's had enough petting.

I've gotten much better at reading his behavior, so I don't push it. With a 100 lbs of muscle and teeth, I know I won't win that battle, so I don't even go there. I'm working on re-establishing pack leadership as well, and people visiting are told to keep petting to a minimum if at all.

I understand how frustrating this problem is, as it doesn't make sense to us humans.

Thanks Stephanie.
I know the problem is unwanted and please dont take this the wrong way but its good to know were not alone. The way you describe it is spot on.
Boston has never gone for a bite so i guess im lucky there.
What you say makes so much sense.
Did you raise the issue on here, could you post a link by any chance?
Many thanks
Andrew

http://leerburg.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/201746/page/0/fpart/1
(hopefully this works, I'm really not that computer savvy.)

http://leerburg.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/200321/page/0/fpart/1

The above one was about the aggression while being pet. This was my original post about my aggression troubles.

Wow, awfull lot of information in those two threads.

Well Stephanie, not a problem near as serious as yours but want to nip in the bud so it doenst get there. Thank you ever so much for the links. it really has been a weight of my shoulders.

So he's not a petting dog (the gent with that sig, brill posts). This does sadden me. But will be alloof, restrict his freedom etc and go back several paces to re-establish sound pack strucure.

Andrew, I have seen some dogs that display a similar response to what you described, as though they are all the sudden fearful. Sometimes, it almost seems as though the coming of age pup KNOWS that it is crossing a line, and is expecting the discipline, but just HAS to try it anyway just in case...
structure is instinctive in a dog, so this is not the same as someone claiming a dog "knows when it did wrong" or anythign that would suggest they remember tearing up the couch 5 hours ago.
When a dog is challenging for rank, the response is either acceptance or a returning challenge that is stronger than theirs. They test rank because that keeps the pack strong, and keeps the strongest one in charge. This increases every members' chance for survival. When he challenges you, it's either because he feels cornered, or because he has established (in subtle ways no doubt) that he is actually in charge, and you are disrespecting his position.
Take the advice given with the leadership exercises, visit the vet to make sure, but also:
try not to "hover" over him to make sure its not a fear based "cornered" response.
Also - how is he fed? Free choice? Scheduled meal times? Does he have a time limit?
Where is he fed? In the middle of a bunch of people walking around the kitchen? Does he have the room to himself when he eats? Have you ever taken the food away while he was eating it to "teach" him? Have you taken bones or other things away to try and teach him not to bite you when you take them?
The reason I ask is because eating and feeding times are a huge thing to dogs.
Whoever controls the food is in charge. Free feeding allows the dog to decide when to eat, and how much. Not good for health reasons, but also because it promotes aggression and dominance.
When the dog is fed, it should have a time limit, or until he walks away from the food. I usually give 10 mins (but it's usually gone in 2) If the dog still has it's nose in the bowl, I let it finish, but the minute it leaves, it's gone.
Don't leave bowls down, pick them up. With some dogs I have even had to pick up water bowls to prevent guarding.
A dog should be able to eat in peace, no matter what. Yes, you ideally should be able to pick up the food bowl while they are eating. But there is no reason. You already gave the food to the dog, taking it away, even to add more food or give it right back is bullying the dog. If you do mess with their food, it is hands down a great way to destroy trust with the dog. With a high drive dog, it can cause a bigger response than with a dog that doesn't really care. I recommend feeding in the crate, always. That way, the dog eats in peace, no kids (yours or visiting) can get in the way or get nipped for being to close, and the dog doesn't ever begin to resource guard (usually) because there is no need.
Sorry for the long post. just covering something that wasn't yet mentioned.

Hi Cameron.
He was crate raised until about 14 months. Fed in the crate. Time limit, eat it or loose it, noy an issue as he wolfs back his food. fed on Arden Grange.
Crate gradually was phased out as he was house trained and not destructive.
Fed in the kitchen after we have eaten and our settled down to watch telly.
Yes if needs be i can lift his food no problems but i dont see the need to do this. He does absolutly no gaurding over toys or food, this was established at 8 weeks old. Everything is mine, i let him have my things.
Mrs struggeld with pack stucuture at first but caught on. She wont let him through doors first, when she tells him to down etc he does until released.
Father was a game keeper for Royal Air Force airfields, i know most of the basics, just never seen this before. Yes i admit he is the most dominant cheeky sob ive dealt with but i thought i had it sussed. The growling when getting affetcion stumped me.
What has been sayed makes sense, especially where you put the fear thing over correction/reprecusion for the growl.