In an earlier post, I talked about switching my dog to a raw diet. It started out a little shakey, but with everyones help here, he's now eating fine. However, he has lost a few pounds. I'm pretty sure this it's just the transitioning to a new diet. It's only been about a month afterall, but his ribs are starting to show a little. Now that he's eating everything I'm sure he'll put his weight back on.

I decided to take him to my vet for a check up just in case it might be something else. Besides, it's probabaly been about 2 years since he's even been to the vet, so I figured a check up would be a good idea anyway.

The first thing the vet does is ask what I feed, I tell her I just switched to raw and she shakes her head and tells me she's not too keen on the raw diet. She bases this on living in Ithica, NY where a lot of people try "alternative" diets with their dogs. She said dogs on raw never did well because they didn't have the proper balance of nutrition. "Dogs do best with a Complete & Balanced kibble, they don't need variety, I'm not skeptical with the dog food companies".

So right away I'm a little uncomfortable. Totally dismissing a natural diet simply because a few people don't get it right? Then she insists on the yearly vaccinations and heartworm pills, even though, besides being a little on the skinny side, my dog is in perfect health. Shuggie is 3 1/2 and she said dogs are still prone to disease at that young of an age.

What do you think of this? Would something like this cause you to seek a new vet? Does anyone know a good holistic type vet in the Phoenix, AZ area? I actually live in Gilbert, so anywhere in Chandler, Mesa, Tempe or Gilbert would work too.

Thanks!

 Quote: trevor lears

....She said .... "Dogs do best with a Complete & Balanced kibble, they don't need variety, I'm not skeptical with the dog food companies". .... Then she insists on the yearly vaccinations and heartworm pills, even though, besides being a little on the skinny side, my dog is in perfect health. .... Would something like this cause you to seek a new vet? ...

Yes, it would.

Heartworm, however, as an aside, has now been diagnosed in every state. That's the *only* thing I can agree with in what you report about her comments!

BTW, when you are figuring on the % of weight to feed, it works well to use the ideal weight rather then the current weight in your calculations.

JMO.

I hope someone in your area has a good vet to recommend. The one you are quoting sounds like one of the ones who buy everything the pharmaceutical and commercial food companies push.

your dog looking skinnier on raw is TOTALLY normal and nothing to worry about. dogs get more of a tucked waist on this diet. this is a good thing.

if you can see or feel his spine or hip bones, feed more. if you can't see or feel his ribs, feed less. seeing the last two ribs and not seeing the spine or hip bones is what you should be aiming for.

i would--and have--definitely seek out a different vet if they don't want you to feed raw and insist on annual vaccinations. no questinon.

Trevor,
First and fore most I would not worry to much about what your vet told you about the RAW diet, most vets are trained by the dog food companies in that area and needless to say they do not support the RAW diet at all. My vet is not crazy about it but has seen the results in my 9 month old dog, every where I go I get told what a great coat and skin he has so I do not let my vet sell me dog food so to speak. I also have my vet to not give my dog shoots of any kind unless I am in full agreement with them. I live in Texas so heart worms and fleas and the like are a year round problem for me, so I keep my dog on Frintline and Sential for heart worms and other things. So do not let your vet just give your dog any kind of shoots unless you fully know what they are giving them.
I can not recommend a vet to you but would more than likely begin to call around and ask about other vets in your area and then ask them before you go what their feelings are in regard to the RAW based diet. Your dog is going through an adjustment period from kibble to the RAW diet so I would not be to concerned about the loss of weight, just add a little extra for a bit and watch and weigh Shuggie on a regular basis, like once a week. Just get on the scales yourself and weigh and then pick Shuggie up and get on so you can track the weight for a little while. The switch from kibble to raw some times takes a bit, after all your dog is used to having a bunch of fillers and the like as well as taste added to the food that they were getting. Now the only taste they get is from RAW natural food, which in most cases does not taste like a kibble does, so it may take a bit longer. You also have to learn what the right ratio is for your dog to keep and maintain thier weight, that can take a little while to figure out.
Yes I would more than likely seek a new vet.
Jay

I'm with Alice and Jay 100%, and I want to add something.

For feeding raw, you may have to settle for a vet who accepts it and doesn't try to talk you out of it. My own vet now (since my old one retired) does not recommend raw, but she doesn't try to scare me, either. Her comment is "I can't argue with your results." That's as good as I can get and still have the vet be as close to me, geographically, as I prefer. (I would not stay with a vet who was set against my dogs' diet; I believe that these vets can tend sometimes to see the diet as being at fault every time the dog comes in for anything. )

The boosters, though, are a deal-breaker for me.

And fortunately, the updated vaccination protocol is much more commonly accepted than even a year ago, so it's not quite the reach that finding proponents of raw food can be.

I would definitely talk about it in advance, and make clear in writing that no vaccinations are administered without my written consent.

Good luck!

Thanks everyone. She didn't flat out tell me to stop with raw, but it was definitely frowned upon. That, combined with the vaccination thing turned me off.

What is the "updated vaccination protocol" Connie?

Also, with the heartworm, I had him tested, it came out negative. I did purchase a six month supply of heart guard. The vet told me to give him one once a month. From what I've read, you don't really have to worry about heartworm except during the warmer months of the year. Plus, I live in a drier climate, not as nurturing to mesquitoes as wet and humid weather.

I guess I'll search the internet and the phone book and try to find another vet, but if anyone here lives in my area and has a good vet that's open to alternative diets and treatments, please let me know.

Could it be that some vets are opposed to raw diets because they've seen the effects of people feeding their dogs a poor raw diet? Obviously, some vets are swayed by the almighty pet food dollar, but they're not all that way.

I'm doing my own research into raw because I think, done properly, it is the best way to go. But I am concerned that I may miss something and accidentally do my dog harm. The way I feel now is that I'd rather feed a high quality human grade kibble (with raw additions) than a poorly concocted raw diet...until I feel confident. There are so many helpful people on the subject here, and Ed and Cindy's articles and references to books are invaluable. But it is a lot of info to absorb for the newb and I don't want to make any big mistakes while I'm learning! I have a hard enough time making sure that I eat a balanced diet!!!

I think vets should do the research and hand out a copy of what constitutes a correctly done raw diet. It is beyond the scope of a 15-30 minute appointment to explain everything that is involved, but perhaps they can direct people to the proper sources. The vet's first priority should be animal health not animal dollars.

I'm going to ask my vet about that soon. I have a lot of respect for him and he has a lot of respect for me and all of my solo research...especially considering vaccinations.

 Quote: Amber Morgan

Could it be that some vets are opposed to raw diets because they've seen the effects of people feeding their dogs a poor raw diet? Obviously, some vets are swayed by the almighty pet food dollar, but they're not all that way.

I'm doing my own research into raw because I think, done properly, it is the best way to go. But I am concerned that I may miss something and accidentally do my dog harm. The way I feel now is that I'd rather feed a high quality human grade kibble (with raw additions) than a poorly concocted raw diet...until I feel confident. There are so many helpful people on the subject here, and Ed and Cindy's articles and references to books are invaluable. But it is a lot of info to absorb for the newb and I don't want to make any big mistakes while I'm learning! I have a hard enough time making sure that I eat a balanced diet!!!

I think vets should do the research and hand out a copy of what constitutes a correctly done raw diet. It is beyond the scope of a 15-30 minute appointment to explain everything that is involved, but perhaps they can direct people to the proper sources.

I'm going to ask my vet about that soon. I have a lot of respect for him and he has a lot of respect for me and all of my solo research...especially considering vaccinations.

In my experience, many vets have experienced their only nutritional education in classrooms and with material paid for by commercial food manufacturers.

So far, the reasons I have heard vets give have had nothing to do with careless designing of the raw diet. That would be an argument I could respect.

I'd love to have a vet who researched and advised about feeding fresh food. They exist, but they are few and far between (so far).

Sounds like your vet is the kind I love to hear about, respecting your vaccination research. Excellent! How'd you find him?

 Quote: Connie Sutherland

Sounds like your vet is the kind I love to hear about, respecting your vaccination research. Excellent! How'd you find him?

Just by trial and error. I won't tolerate anyone in the medical community that I don't feel good about; I do the same thing with my MD and my son's pediatrician. When you visit a doctor you are giving them the ultimate trust...this is your health...your life and your quality of life at stake. It's a big deal. So I have no patience for arrogance in doctors (or vets) and I especially won't put up with an impatient or condescending attitude.

Some doctors, and some vets, have no time for explaining their opinions or decisions but I have no time for them. Do you remember that dirtball vet who told me that all Corgis were vicious? It's a small community I live in and I have used that to spread the word about him. I also wrote a letter to the hospital he works for.

Wow. That was quite a little tangent wasn't it? Anyway, I'm just as strong in my support of the good ones, and this particular guy is great. He seems to really consider the animal first. He will try an inexpensive non-invasive treatment first before suggesting invasive testing or surgery, and he will only order that if he thinks that the results will be able to help the animal.

For example, I have a friend who I recently found out sees my vet as well. She has an elderly lab/collie mix who developed a tumor near his front leg. She took him in and the vet suggested not even testing to see if it was benign or not because even the biopsy would be risky enough at the dog's advanced age...but if it turned out to be malignant, surgery would be seriously risky and could easily cause the dog to die sooner than it would than if left alone. He monitors the dog regularly and so far so good.

In other words, the testing and potential surgery wouldn't justify the risk to the dog's quality of remaining life. And he really respects that people's individual opinons on their dog's treatments are valid.

He's a really good guy...I wish he could treat me!

Trevor,

Try this site: http://www.holisticvetlist.com/
There's a section where you type in the modalities you want your vet to practice, state, city, etc., and it comes up with a list of vets. Some do both regular & alternative, while others just concentrate on alternative. I meant to find the link to the new vac. schedule, but can't seem to locate it. It's basically a 3 yr thing as opposed to every year. Doing a blood titre would help as well to see if your dog's still good to go.

Good luck!