i'm pretty ashamed of myself today. i got in a fight with my dog.

i took him and teagan backpacking - we weren't supposed to be back until tuesday, actually - and they did great, shared the backseat (buckled in, but still) and slept in the tent together, fine on the campsite.

i noticed last night though, once we'd stopped hiking and got into camp, luc started shivering. he wouldn't go near the fire, so i put him in the tent so he could be on the thermarest and sleeping bag.

i made him a huge warm nest, but he moved partially off it and was shaking when i woke up this morning. i can't have him freezing when we're stopped (i tried clothes, since i didn't bring his jacket - he's a GSD and it's early november!), it's not good. so i decided we would hike back out.

when i went to put on his back this morning, he started freaking out. i need him to wear his pack, so i wasn't all that patient or sympathetic, and i kept on trying. then, he bit me. which, unfortunately, made me lose my temper, and i just kept trying to get the pack on him. he bit me again and i kicked him off me, which i am roundly ashamed off as i should have just pulled away - it was more of a reaction but i should have been in better control so as to never do that. i also tried forcing him to the ground, i was so mad. eventually, i was so furious i picked him up and carried him around, hugging him hard (it helped, actually).

he's often a bit pissy about me putting on that particular pack, so i finally thought to empty it out, and then put it on him, and....that was fine. i'd also been petting him and calming us both down. the final tally - i don't have any punctures, but i have 3 cuts (scrapes that bled all over my hand) some other scrapes including 2 on my face, and a couple of bruises on my hand with red centres. but it was my fault.

my brother said 'he must have not been feeling well' and it's true, his tail is bothering him (at first i thought i did it, i cried about an hour of the drive home) but i realized he was holding it down all this morning, pre-me being a complete idiot. it's getting better, i'm wondering if he shaked so much he has sore muscles, as he can lift it and wag. but i bet that was why he was so pack-resistant. i guess it says something about me that i assumed he was doing it b/c he was being a jerk

both dogs were off their tie outs when this happened (being packed in their packs) and when luc started at me teagan went in at him. i had to take her away and tie her to a tree, and whenever he tried to bite me/bit me she would start whining and give short barks. now she likes me, and was extremely affectionate this trip, but i don't think she was trying to defend me (it's not quite two weeks yet i've had her), i'm thinking she was reinforcing pack structure? as soon as he had the pack on and we were all calm (i was also crying then, great leadership on my part....i'm so mad at myself) i let her off and she ran at him snarling. i took her away, and then again had her on leash, when i went to get luc, she went around him and nipped his back leg. we did another removal, and then for the first 5 minutes of our hike, she led, he was behind me, but then they seemed to forget it and walked and sniffed together.

luc is being affectionate with me, i'm lucky i have such a forgiving dog. i love him so much, i can't even say, and i really hate how i behaved this morning. and he and teagan seem fine together, which is relief, as not only was my behaviour bad from a luc-centric point of view, but from a luc and teagan point of view it does not seem to be ideal. anyways, i feel lucky their both being so good and am kicking myself a good deal, i don't know why i had to force the issue (though i did need him to wear the pack).

i think i know why luc was so cold (teagan was not at all). he has a couple of bald spots on his underside, i need to speak to the vet about, and also, with all the running he's doing, he appears to have a pretty low body fat, and i think the two together combined to make him chilly (it was -8C overnight). unlike me, he's not allowed junk food....

anyways, i'm not at all pleased with myself. in reviewing the incident and how my behaviour has been with luc, i've also realized - i've been really strong on groundwork w/teagan, but softer/spoiling luc ('so he won't think i don't love him')....probably a pretty dumb idea.

i took the dogs for a walk when we got home, and there was a bunch of kids with a lab (of course) barking and straining at the leash and freaking out and they were all laughing at their dog freaking out at mine. luc and teagan stayed calm, but i was a bit worried about teagan - she doesn't have the personality to be trifled with - but i thought 'give her the benefit of the doubt'. well - yeah, she never barked, but the second we got level with the lab, she turned and WENT for him. the kid with the dog stopped mid-laugh and screamed (which, immaturely, i found humorous). teagan didn't get closer than 2 feet, as i had her leash fairly tight. apparently a non-vocal GSD in 'don't mess with me' mode is fairly intimidating. the lab shut up, anyways.

Ok, your post was pretty lengthy so I stopped reading after the first 10 paragraphs or so...

While it is indeed horrible to lose your temper and take it out on your dog, it happens to the best of us.

The good news is that you didn't go so overboard that he's in avoidance of you. He forgave you so he's a sweetheart and you don't have to continue agonizing over what you did

Just be more gentle next time you're in a similar situation (putting a pack on), just in case he remembers what happened to him last time by association and gets nervous about it.

oh, thank you.

i'm being really upbeat/happy/positive around the dogs, and they're responding to that. (it's just in private i'm kicking myself)

i have a grave suspicion i'm not succinct at the best of times....being upset definitely doesn't bring it out

I'm worse than you in terms of over-writing...

Forgive yourself already, you're just human and you didn't really go and hurt him or anything.

Think of all the good you did in saving Luc and in socializing him, in training him, in raising his self confidence and in turning him into 100 times the dog he was when you found him. You should be proud of yourself for everything you've done for this dog, he's lucky to have you.

You clearly have a great bond with him and he trusts you. Continue being a great pack leader with him and he'll forget what happened last night (I'd bet he already has!).

For future reference though, if you're feeling tense and on edge, it's probably best to put the dog away (crate, tie out, whatever) for a few minutes until you can regain your composure. Dogs can sense a tense leader and it can make them act more "annoying" than usual - maybe whinier, clingier, more jumpy and nippy etc.

One thing I sometimes do when one of my dogs accidentally bites me REALLY hard during drivework and I feel the urge to smack them because of the pain I'm in: I simply grit my teeth and insult them in a calm tone of voice.

It helps me release some of my anger at being hurt yet the dogs don't know what I'm saying so it doesn't affect them at all and they stay happy. Usually by the time the bleeding stops I'm back to being my calm happy self again and we can resume the training...

(I feel so silly writing this, haha)

Relax, they won't even remember the incident tomorrow.

thanks! you guys are making me feel a lot better.

and yup, future - i will work on backing away, counting to ten, that sort of thing.

i'm off to take the brats for a walk!

Just a thought, this year we had Jazzmann in the pool before it really got warm. She got out and the next day was freaking out in pain. We figured out that her tail wasn't moving and she was holding it down, wouldn't wag it or anything and heaven forbid one of us touch it. I took her to the vet immediately and he told us that it was quite common in labs and hunting dogs because when they get into the water before its really warm the cold causes some "syndrome" to happen w/the tail causing extreme pain. Nothing they can do but give pain meds and after a few days it subsides but maybe the cold caused this to happen to Luc.

In the meantime, let me say that my reaction would have been the same if he had bit me three times. Except I wouldn't have let him bite me three times before I wrestled and pinned him to the ground, my temper would have flared after the first bite. If he had bit the alpha male in the pack, do you think he would have stood there and taken it? No way! Now we are humans and supposed to know better but sometimes we just screw up. Thank heavens they are so forgiving of our frailties as humans. Don't beat yourself up, Jennifer. Just learn from the experience and move on, they do

....still not off on our walk.

well, i kept on thinking, 'be calm, be calm' except i wasn't calm, and i was getting madder. and, plus, the trainers who's advice i'm not following told me to beat him down (mind you, they said to deliberately provoke his aggression, but i kept on thinking of how i don't like them, and yeah....)

that's really good to know about jazzman....well, not good that it happened, but the dogs did go through a couple of streams/rivers (some of us are better at crossing on rocks and logs than others....). what you're describing sounds a lot like luc. he is letting me touch his tail, but it's obviously bothering him, and as he's been warmer, it's getting better....hmmmm....

okay, now i'm really off

Yuko, Taro is GORGEOUS!! Nice pic!

The snow really makes him stand out (although, I could do w/o the snow>>>desert rat, this one

Edited by RobbinMann (11/10/2007 10:26 PM)
Edit reason: boo boo in grammar

FWIW, this syndrome goes by a number of different names, "cold water tail" being one. It's very common in sporting dogs but any dog can get it.

http://www.thelabradorclub.com/library/coldwatertail.html