Keep in mind I'm nowhere near doing formal heel yet. Suzzie is doing pretty well walking beside me casually though. I'm very pleased with her progress and the manners she shows when we meet other people. Fortunately for me, we have some very nice walking trails down in the woods near my house. They aren't commonly used, but I do see people down there from time to time. Actually, mostly who I see down there is other people walking their dogs.

Since my normal walking time doesn't usually coincide with others, I've taken to allowing Suzzie to drag her leash along the trail instead of making her walk by my side. There's a couple things I've noticed about this.

First, she has a very different gait than I do. Of course, I knew that to be true; but letting her walk on her own really shows it. My pattern is walk, walk, walk, Mr. Steady Pace. Her pattern is run, stop and sniff, walk, run, stop and sniff. If you averaged her pace out it matches mine. She's either lagging behind or running ahead. She does a pretty good job of staying close-ish to me. She's got a 20' line on her and she'll about double that distance between us. When she heads off in the wrong direction, I call her back and she comes running back to take the right trail.

Second, after walks like this she's usually a lot more restful and calm when we get home than if we do straight line walking around the block -- even for the same distance and/or time. I think the running and stopping and the sniffing is a lot more engaging to her.

All's not well in paradise though. I have a couple problems/questions. First, we do occasionally see other people walking their dogs. Over the two or three weeks we've been walking in the woods we've run across two people with their dogs. In both cases they had multiple dogs and were off leash. While I think this is a very good form of exercise for Suzzie I'm a little worried about us running into a dog and things going bad before I can recall her.

Second, I wonder if this has any affect on our learning to walk nicely. While I'm proud of how well she does, she still has room for improvement. I'm hoping that we can continue to work on it. I must say though that "work on it" really just means "on the job training" while we walk. There's a 1/4 mile or so we have to walk through the neighborhood to get to the woods and that's about all the "training" time she gets on a leash.

Anyway, I'd really appreciate your thoughts on this. I want to do right by my dog, train her well, and maximize the efficiency of the exercise we get.

Hi Doug,

I'm a fan of off leash dog walking - when it can be done safely in appropriate areas. I think you're absolutely right about it being much more tiring for the dog than a straight up walk next to the human, but it IS inherently riskier (re unexpected encounters with other dogs, people, wildlife, etc), and there are some keys you should focus on in order to make it as successful as possible.

1. Recall. It sounds like you and Suzzie are doing great so far, but keep up training, and I'd keep that drag line on her until you feel like she's as close to 100% reliable as possible. There's always a chance that she might encounter something in her exploration that she's never seen before (and that you've consequently not trained as a distraction) so having a "safety line" could come in very handy. Having extra delicious treats with you for rewards under such distracting circumstances could help, if Suzie is keen on food rewards.

2. Release command. This will help separate Suzzie's more formal walking rules from her more casual off leash rules - there's no reason off leash time has to interfere with established training regarding walking/heeling, but the more clearly you can separate the two activities in her mind, the better. Off leash certainly shouldn't mean that NO rules apply , but the fact that she's allowed to sniff whatever she pleases, pee wherever she wants, and otherwise zig and zag to her heart's content is certainly different than marching along "in the zone" by your side. Similarly, as "let's walk" once you clip her back up will let her know free time is over.

3. Always play it safe, use caution and pay attention to the dog and your surroundings: if you can't see very far ahead of you on any given trail (can't see if there are oncoming dogs/animals) - pick up the leash, or recall the dog into a heel; if you're nearing any trail that comes within uncomfortable distance to roads/traffic - pick up the leash, or recall the dog into a heel; if for any reason you see Suzzie looking like she's about to bolt after a scent - you get the idea. Oscar has a "face" that he puts on when he picks up the smell of something he'd like to eat - it only takes a second for me recognize it and stop him, but you have to be watching like a hawk... and an ounce of prevention...

 Quote: Doug Alcorn

While I think this is a very good form of exercise for Suzzie I'm a little worried about us running into a dog and things going bad before I can recall her.

This is a risk you'll run if you're walking on trails that you know are frequented by other dog walkers. The fact that it sounds like everyone else lets their dogs off leash as well does not help the case - even if Suzzie were leashed, an off leash dog could easily charge you and you'd have a similarly bad situation. Aside from the suggestions above, and walking at off hours, there's not much more you can do to cover your bases. If you start to encounter regular situations with strange dogs that make you nervous though, I'd find a new place to walk altogether.

Otherwise, have fun! You're fortunate that you have what sounds like a beautiful natural spot to romp in so close to your home. Suzie is a lucky girl.

~Natalya

I agree that a dog needs some time to suss out it's environment. I would be careful about it though, and would consider hanging on to the end of the line, at least never letting it get beyond your ability to grab it.

AND:-)

I would alternate more frequently between having her walk nicely with you, then releasing her to her sniffing, then with you, then sniffing, etc. so she understands that even in the woods she's expected to walk nicely beside you, and that being released to sniff around is a reward for walking nicely, and at your discretion. She's still young and learning the rules, so structure to the walks is a beautiful thing.

Be aware too, that many puppies with fabulous recall reach an age where they suddenly develop 'selective hearing'. If you aren't connected to the end of the line when this happens, you'll be helpless to do anything about it and Suzzie will have the opportunity to ignore you and get away with it. I would definitely keep hold of the line.

I would bring some pepper spray just in case you run into an off-leash dog that isn't friendly, and make sure that your dog doesn't approach these dogs either. You won't have to worry about this if you are always on the end of the line.

I don't know if it's anything you'd like to consider or not, but I use an electric collar on my dog when let him off leash. With training, this collar is like having an invisible leash. I love having my dog off-leash but don't like worrying about whether he'll recall or not. I trained him to come to a whistle to the point that he can't help himself, and that's what I use in conjunction with the collar. It works really well if you take the time to train, and the sound of the whistle is hard to ignore.

It's good advice to keep vigilant. I think I may start keeping a hold on the line. I think she'd like to have more than 20' slack on either side of me; but the safety is probably worth it. An electric collar is something I think I'll eventually do.

I need more structure in working with recall though. I don't always walk with treats, but probably should. When I have my treat pouch on and we do recall in the yard it's usually fairly successful.

I think I am having a general problem of drive and focus, but don't want to side track this tread too much. Sooner than later I'll get Ed's DVD on the subject. Suzzie is fairly obedient, but she definitely doesn't have the "snap to" obedience I see in some of your videos.

Thanks for the reassurance and advice.

I highly recommend the "Drive and Focus" DVD. It's a nice, positive way to keep the fun and excitement in obedience training.

It's not too much of a sidetrack: Doing the drive work with your dog contributes a LOT to your dog seeing you as the 'funnest' thing in the Universe, thereby helping your recall

 Quote: natalya zahn

1. Recall. It sounds like you and Suzzie are doing great so far, but keep up training, and I'd keep that drag line on her until you feel like she's as close to 100% reliable as possible. There's always a chance that she might encounter something in her exploration that she's never seen before (and that you've consequently not trained as a distraction) so having a "safety line" could come in very handy. Having extra delicious treats with you for rewards under such distracting circumstances could help, if Suzie is keen on food rewards.

2. Release command. This will help separate Suzzie's more formal walking rules from her more casual off leash rules - there's no reason off leash time has to interfere with established training regarding walking/heeling, but the more clearly you can separate the two activities in her mind, the better. Off leash certainly shouldn't mean that NO rules apply , but the fact that she's allowed to sniff whatever she pleases, pee wherever she wants, and otherwise zig and zag to her heart's content is certainly different than marching along "in the zone" by your side. Similarly, as "let's walk" once you clip her back up will let her know free time is over.

That #2 is something I see lots of owners forget. It's part of what makes the walk what it is, for me: Dogs marching along my route at my speed and under my direction, but then allowed (at my discretion) to be a dog for periods along the way. The best of all worlds.

YOU give the release, so the dog has fun and sniffs around and enjoys himself, but with the handler's OK.

It's fun to incorporate ob in this. The release can be a reward for any command(s) you like. Example: "Wait." Everyone stops and waits. Wait (or whatever command you use) can start by being a three-second thing, and can gradually have duration built in, like anything else. Then the reward for my guys is "OK!" which is their release word, and which means that I stand while they have either the length of the leash or a dropped leash (depending on where we are) until the walk resumes.

 Quote: Doug Alcorn

.... I don't always walk with treats ....

I don't either, but what a nice thing it is when the dog is occasionally marked/rewarded for a long-ago-learned command. When you're on a walk, the surprise appearance of a food reward or a tug for an old command that has long ago passed the teaching phase is really fun.

And IMHO: Why not?

Not only that, but a walk is a great opportunity for a short session on a currently-being-taught command; it's a venue change, with far more distraction than in the yard or the house .....

My dogs have 100% recall. (as close as anything or anyone can be to 100%)but I still NEVER take my dogs off my property without e-collars on them. I take my dogs everywhere & work them everywhere.... School & sport fields, friend's yards & property, parks etc. I don't want to ever (if possible) have anything happen that would put my dogs out of my control. I want to be able to enforce a command no matter what. There are often geese, other dogs at a distance & other critters on the fields also that my dogs completely ignore so long as they don't get between me, my dogs & their balls. I usually put my dogs in a down & chase the geese off the field or send my dogs to do it. With that said, I will say that in all the 5 years that I have been doing this I have only had to give my dogs a nick 1x when they were attacked on one of the school fields that I take them to. I had a pitbull break away from its owner (was dragging a leash) & come charging across the field (from almost 2 acres away) to attack my dogs. There was nothing that I could do to stop this dog, so my dogs took care of it. They mixed it up for about 1/2 mninute & then chased the dog off, at which point I recalled my dogs & although they turned to come back this dog kept coming back & re-engaging my female & then my male would jump back in. After the 2nd time that this happened I recalled my dogs & gave both my dogs low level nick just to distract them a second & yelled at the other dog & mine came runing back to me. I think that by this time the attacking dog had started to realize that he was not in a winning position against 2 dogs, which also helped to slow things down, but I also know that my female would not have stopped as long as this dogs kept charging her. All of this took place within 15ft of me. At this point the other dog's owner was running over our way calling his dog (which of course was truning a deaf ear this whole time)& then chasing after him after the dog ran back across the field. It was one of those situations where there was nothing you could do. My dogs kept trying to come back to me & kept being attacked so by nicking them (it was a last resort to break the cylce & hickup their brains)it was what it took to stop the chaios. So I guess that I am saying you have to always be prepared & do what you have to do to keep the odds in your favor for a sucessful outcome for your dogs & their safety.

BTW... I haven't seen this jerk & his dog on the field since. I guess he figured that he was lucky that I didn't call the cops, which I should have, & he still has his dog, which he wouldn't have if I did call the cops. Since there was 2 little league practices going on when this was happening. (another reason to stop it before someone got caught up in the middle of it) & since this stupid jerk had no control at all of his dog, I was the one that had to stop it from esculating. It was too bad that my dogs had to pay the price & get nicked when they were only protecting themselves, but such is life sometimes. At least they weren't hurt & they still got to stay out on the field & chase their balls & play for a while. You can't control what someone else does so you have to be prepared to control what you can..YOUR DOGS.

My dogs grew up draging cotton long lines out on the fields, even when out there in the early stages of e-collar training on the fields. (Need to clarify..,my dogs were e-collar train in my fenced yard before being out in the open fields with e-collars) I would be very careful using a drag line or a leash with a handle out in the woods. It only takes a second for a dog to get caught up & get hurt. You would be better to train with an e-collar & use it in the woods or out on trails. Also having great treats to share with them when they recall in the woods or on a trail & a nice thing to encourage their return to you. JMO

I always start puppies off-leash. I have found that allowing them freedom seems to quell the urge to take it later on. I don't have any dogs (except the demon Widget) who I cannot trust off leash to listen/recall. However, there are outside dangers as everyone has acknowledged.

I make sure they are right by my side if I am in an area where I can not see a good distance in front of me(around a bend, etc.) The worst I have run into was coyotes trying to separate us from 2 sides. The average idiots w/their uncontrolled Labs are much easier. If I see a potentially dangerous distraction, I immediately recall and put in a "fuss" or a "stay close." "Stay close" means stay near me but you don't have to do a formal heel. Once the problem passes, I say "free."

If you do this alot, (keep making them check in at regular intervals) they may start doing it on their own. Mine do. And Caleb always comes back to a fuss now if someone is coming toward us...he knows the drill and he knows that he will get his freedom back as soon as they pass. Qira is not quite there yet, but of course she is only 20 mos. If I don't call her well in advance of her alerting on the potential problem, she has been known to be less than cooperative and tell a jogger that they are tresspassing on her trail. While the last time she did that she was very small (4mos or so) and he laughed at her (thankfully), I doubt anyone would appreciate it now. I do keep her on a leash or an ecollar at all times as she is young and there are infinite possibilities of scenarios she has not seen and will not be proofed on. I admit to not always doing this w/Caleb, but I really probably should. There could be that one "he's never done that before" time.

As a safety precaution, you can use a long line, but on my older dogs who I know what they do in certain situations, I just keep a pull tab on them w/a prong collar. That way, as we pass the problem, I have the ability to correct. On a younger dog who might not recall in the face of potential danger, keep a long line or an ecollar. I use ecollars on the page setting. I have 2 Dogtra systems; a 202 and a 2202. If they are too far up ahead, the pager feature works great; they always come running back, and in a worst case scenario, you have the power to correct. Be sure that your dog understands the collar before using it in an emergency. Otherwise, you could end up shutting her down and leaving her confused and vulnerable to whatever danger you are trying to protect her from.

 Quote: Jenni Williams

I always start puppies off-leash.

Meaning in an enclosed area, right?



Just clarifying ... obviously, a starting pup has no reliable recall.