First of all, I am going through similar things right now with Cody. He is a wonderful little guy, and full, I mean full of energy. This is what I am doing right now. ALl toys are mine and stay up. When he tries to knaw on my hand, I try and distract him, either with a toy (during play time) or with a treat, asking him to sit. Or I leave him and he walks after me. He pulls really hard too and I am going to do just what was recommended, stop and call back reward. I did this with Bindi and she would think I was crazy, she would look back at me and I would call her to me and reward her. It is a long process but works well and can be used at any age.
I get Cody up and outside right away in the morning, then we eat, then he wanders around the kitchen tv area until I take Bindi out at 7:30 in the morning, when we go out, he goes in his crate, and I take him out at 9:00 am. I put his lead on take him outside and practice walking on a leash. I no matter what try and not get frustrated and try, (try. its hard I know) to think how he sees the world especially since he is crated and only goes outside with me. I also try and end on a positive note. When we are done (work only about 2 minutes) we play, I through the ball in my fenced yard and tire (ha! ha!) him out. I play until he is just getting tired, the we come in and I brush him and talk to him. he hangs around the kitchen for awhile and then back in his crate for his nap. I use this time to train him to love his crate by giving him treats as he goes in when I say, "in your bed". He is doing better every day. I train him in the evening for about 2 more minutes. and through out the time he is wandering in the house, I recall him and treat him when he comes running. Feed him dinner at 3:30, take him out for potty and a little wandering, he like to go and see Mrs. Duck. He doesn't seem like he wants to eat her, but my other dog Bindi is dying for some duck.ha! cody goes to bed at 8:30.
I know pups can be frustrating, and your hands can feel like shredded beef, but, they have no idea what is expected out of them, they have tons of energy and are doing exactly what puppies do. So, you are not doing anything wrong when your pup is chewing, running, pulling, and be a big ball of energy.
What kind of pup do you have? I forgot I am sorry.
You are doing well, take it slowly, give him discipline appropriate for his little age, and exercise, and consistancy and I think you will see it will begin to take in his little dog mind. I can say this because I got bindi my other dog at 1 year, a little over a year old, she new nothing except was crate trained, pulled like crazy on the leash, and I started with her like she was a little pup and after being consistent and putting into practice what ed has shown us, it all came together and she is doing very well now.
Hope this encourages you and helps you
God bless you

Edited by Sharon Empson (01/10/2008 04:13 PM)
Edit reason: oops I forgot

you know, a dog learns alot by just being with you. something that has been used in my family for generations with a new dog and to bring an old one down a notch or two, is to have ot tied around the caretakers/owners waist. I would do this all morning, while Im eating and getting ready and then again when I get home, during all my activites, and it limits the time a dog is in the crate.the dog learns how to just "be" with a person, and it is hyperlink to bonding, ive discovered. As for playing, i would try playing with it in an area where it can be offleash and reserve walks for learning how to walk on a loose lead with you having her attention (not constantly gazing at you but not sniffing,either) when the head goes down, the dog is exploring, its going to be Really hard to teach it to walk easy when its doing this... just a few things that have worked for me

Edited by Mary Velazquez (01/10/2008 04:12 PM)
Edit reason: forgot something

These are all very good ideas. we just got back from our evening walk. i gave her a lot more freedom to look around. I also started stopping with her when she takes off. She takes off constantly. And will run full speed time after time to the end of the lead.

I think you are right as well, she is not getting enough exercise. it's my fault, but during the winter it is especially tough.

It may just take some time and more than anything consistency. It just seems like each day I forget something and need to be refreshed. She is a very dependent dog it seems. she constantly wants to be around people, and no matter how much I leave her alone for her to attempt to get used to it, she whines. She is whining right now in her crate as a matter of fact. She is great at night now, never a peep. has only soiled crate one time....ever....the very first night i had her. so i am lucky there too i guess.

i am trying to use the markers too, or should say i have tried, it just seems like i forget to do it sometimes.


I just want her to be happy and not bored to the point of going nuts. Of course I want to be happy too. I will keep trying.

 Quote: Mark Surgenor

i am trying to use the markers too, or should say i have tried, it just seems like i forget to do it sometimes.


I just want her to be happy and not bored to the point of going nuts. Of course I want to be happy too. I will keep trying.

When I have a new adoptee, we are together a LOT.

I'd set aside short time periods to do upbeat motivational marker training every day. Little short happy sessions will remind you about marker-training, give the dog's brain some exercise, strengthen your bond.....

If you start and end on a high note (something, anything, that the dog knows how to do and can be rewarded and praised for) and keep it short, then the dog will be thrilled when you start every training session. In fact, it can be one of the things to use the recall for -- I strengthen the recall by remembering to use it every time the dog is about to get/do something good.

Supper? Call. Car ride? Call. A game? A walk? Fun marker training? Call.

Mark,
If I can be so bold, why did you get a German Short Hair Pointer? Is he going to be a working gun dog? Did you research what you can expect for a highly refined bird dog, energy level, training times reguired, or even how adaptable they are to being pets?? Did he come from a working line? Finally what do you expect from a not quite 4 month old pup of any breed who has had very little (from what your post reads) interaction with it's owner. 4 month pups even in knowing hands are a pain in the butt!
With a little extrapolation, I figure the pup spends what, about 20 hrs. a day in the crate. I'd say he's bonding with the crate just fine. They don't learn everthing you want by being isolated, they are social animals, they learn by BEING WITH and INTERACTING their pack. Not by being thrown in a cage for being what they are, a dog. Remeber, we are a different species from them, they have to learn our language, and while sometimes I have my doubts about who is smarter, its up to us the humans to teach that language to the dog. We do that with patience, consistancy and INTERACTION. Small steps at a time.
The most valuable piece of training advice I've read or heard (I can't remember which) was: The dog is smart, he is always learning something from you (the owner). Good, bad, indifferent. He's always learning. It's always better to teach him what you want him to learn. Mark, he wants to be part of your life, show him the way.

Patience, consistancy, interaction, patience.


If my dog isn't learning, I'm doing something wrong.
Randy

 Quote: randy allen

Patience, consistancy, interaction, patience.

'Zackly. I think Mark is feeling his way, and possibly (1) forgetting how young the dog is, and (2) mistakenly equating lack of playtime with the dog as a trigger for inspiring the dog's respect.

 Quote: mark surgenor

These are all very good ideas. we just got back from our evening walk. i gave her a lot more freedom to look around. I also started stopping with her when she takes off. She takes off constantly. And will run full speed time after time to the end of the lead.

I think you are right as well, she is not getting enough exercise. it's my fault, but during the winter it is especially tough.

It's YOUR call when the dog is released to sniff and look around. I agree with you about stopping when you release her so there is no confusion about who leads whom.

In-the-house exercise is good too. There's a cabin fever thread going on with suggestions for that.

I like to start a lot of motivational command teaching inside because it's a small space and far less distracting than the yard or park or whatever.

For example, I start a casual "heel" indoors. I have also started the recall in a hallway, as well as backchaining "fetch."

Mark, just a quick note; Ed has a free e-book about training w/ markers, in case you are fuzzy about how to get started...
Here's the link:
http://leerburg.com/pdf/markers.pdf

Once again, some very good advice. And a lot of questions that have been posed. I can't remember all of them, but here are a few:

1. Yes, i researched the GSP before I purchased one. I realize they are very active, very hyper, etc. honestly I have no problem with that. I am a fairly active person myself. The tough part is it's middle of winter and hard to get the dog a lot of outdoor excercise. Another mistake I made by the way, i should have waited until spring to get a dog, but oh well...here i am. I am considering making her a gun dog, but not sure about that yet. I mountain bike, hike, and i am generally active so I think once things progress, the dog will get plenty of exercise.

2. Yes, i need to understand the pup is only 15 weeks of age and give a little bit it appears. That was my main question. The confusion lies in watching the training videos versus listening to what those on the message board say. for instance, 'no play, no toys' in the initial phases of pack structure training. It's like you hear one thing on the videos and something else on the message board. Both may have merit, but obviously it's conflicting as well. Maybe the intent of the videos is there, but the application is a bit off from what i hear on the web postings. Most of the people on here do not train their dogs that way (which makes complete sense to me)...which is abosolutely fine, it just makes things confusing.

3. I love to play with the dog and be around the dog. I may be coming off like some kind of cruel dictator who doesn't allow his puppy to play...but then again, that is excactly what the training video says to do. At this point, i am going to play with the dog as much as possible and let her be a pup, when we get to about 6 months, i will try to be a little more hard nosed.

As far as keeping the dog in the crate for 20 hours, it's not quite that much, however, I work all day and I can't let the dog run loose in my house. I go home for lunch everyday to let the dog out, allow it to play for a bit, etc. In the evening, I take it out and play as well, last night for instance we played so much she just conked out. I don't understand what people who have full time jobs can do otherwise. In the spring, she will be an outside dog. The dog is meant to be outside, unfortunately i bought it at a time where i can't leave it outside so i have to deal with it as best i can. I deal with it by playing in the kichen, playing tug, throwing a ball, etc.

I understand the concept of marker training completely, understand how to do it. It just seems like I get fuzzy headed and forget to do certain things when i am playing with the puppy.

I understand this is solely what i am making it to be by expecting too much. I get way too impatient, which is my problem not the dog's. the other main issue is lack of exercise. I am trying to work on both of those.

Any more advice is appreciated...thanks for the help.