Well at least you have time on your hands. I would like to give my $.02 as a Boxer owner. I disagree w/the drooling and farting. Maybe I'm just lucky or maybe it's the raw, but my dog does not have much flatulence at all. My sister's Pit and friend's GSD will melt your eyebrows though. My Boxer is almost 3 & with SchH training twice a week and throwing the frisbee for her another 2 days, she settles down nicely and is a pleasure in the house. She is an avg shedder, but I prefer small hairs vs clumps. She makes an excellent watch dog, but not sure how she'd do if someone actually came into my house. The heat in AL is probably the only reason I wouldn't recommend a Boxer.

You should also look at a working line Rott. I think they shed less than Boxers, would do better in the heat, make excellent watch (and maybe guard) dogs, and can be pretty mellow. Even if you're not planning on competing in SchH, you can find a really nice temperament that should be easy to handle. Plus, most working Rotts are on the smaller size around 90-115 lbs. Only thing you might have to work on is dog aggression.

Hi again, Bethany,

I have a German shepherd and two cats. My house doesn't smell like any of them. I don't have any carpeting to absorb odors and vacuum frequently, plus brush all of them regularly. However, when my dog gets wet, especially in my vehicle, it can definitely smell like dog in the truck.

One thing you have to watch out for is that most people are very committed to their own breed(s) and will tend to recommend them to others. The important thing for you to do is keep your list of preferences in mind. Read the breed standards (easy to find on the internet for any breed). Do keep in mind that most breed standards tend to focus on the positive aspects and gloss over potentially negative or difficult ones. But, they are a good source of general information about a breed. If you can get to any dog shows, that's a great place to meet the various breeds and talk to breeders about their breeds and traits, etc. (Just don't approach someone who is preparing their dog to go into the ring<g>...wait until they're done showing.)

In my experience, the people who have anything but good intentions in mind who you may encounter out in the world, when you're walking with a dog, tend to respect the dog, period. When my GSD was only 5 months old, and I lived in an inner city, people would cross the street to avoid passing in proximity to us. You seem to be considering decent-sized dogs, and their mere presence with you should be a deterrent to others, especially if it is clear that the dog is obedient and well-trained. People who have bad intentions, and who are used to their own neighbors training dogs to be aggressive, will tend not to want to find out first hand if your dog is aggressive or not. People who are clueless about dogs and harmless in intent, will tend to come up to you and your dog, with or without invitation<g>. (Also, you can teach your dog to bark on command, but instead of or in addition to something like "speak," you can use another word, like "guard." If someone hears you tell your dog to guard and the dog starts barking, they're most likely not going to want or need any more information. I know very little about greyhounds and don't know if this would be a sound strategy for them, as I don't think they bark all that much, but I could be totally wrong there.)

From your description of what you are looking for in a dog, I think the Standard poodle may be a good choice for you. You can keep it in a puppy cut (short all over); it doesn't have to have the fru fru thing going on. I've known quite a few of these dogs, both as pets, and as agility competitors, and they tend to be very nice dogs. With the amount of exercise you are planning to provide, this could be a good choice for you.

As far as getting an older dog, if you do your part, the dog should be able to bond with you. People import adults all the time, people adopt adults all the time...if you put the time and work into it, and establish a sound relationship, you will develop a bond. The more you work with a dog, the stronger the bond will be, and that's regardless of the age of the dog<g>. And, you can always find a young dog, less than a year old, that's not an adult yet.

You're right that GSDs have very dense under coats, and shed constantly, with twice yearly blow outs. It isn't that easy to find a really healthy one, either, and I'm not just talking about hips and elbows. I think, if you were to go with a working line GSD, you'd find yourself with more dog than you seem to be looking for, that would need more exercise and work to thrive than you seem able to devote to a dog at this time in your life. Just my two cents, and you know what that's worth<g>.

leih merigian

If you like a nice, clean dog, that doesn't shed/smell...

Standard poodles are pretty cool dogs. My mom has a black standard, Titan, and he is pretty neat. I almost considered a Poodle... then I snapped back to reality and got my GSD.


Seriously though, Standard Poodles are neat dogs. Smart, energetic, agile, and actually pretty intimidating barkers- they're much larger than a GSD, and have a mouth full of steak knives.

Dogs that have a strong doggy smell either live in kennels, aren't groomed, eat crap food, or all of the above.

That said, even my relatively stink-free dogs smell like dog, and I have never walked into a house that has animals and not known there were animals. But as an animal owner, you get used to the way your house smells and it is neutral to you. To other people, every house always smells different. It's like people that stink, they don't smell themselves, but the people around them can smell it. People with cats and ferrets have the worst smelling houses to me. Some houses just smell cleaner than others, but you can always tell.

Working breeds can bond just as well as any other breed, otherwise police would have to raise their own puppies. What a nightmare that would be.

 Quote: leih merigian

One thing you have to watch out for is that most people are very committed to their own breed(s) and will tend to recommend them to others.

Not me, I try to dissuade people from getting a Ridgeback all the time!! We're a rare little club, and we like it that way..

Seriously though, Bethany, I'm wondering if you might do well with a Ridgeback rescue... since the breed was on your original list anyway, I thought I'd chime in.

 Quote: leih merigian

As far as getting an older dog, if you do your part, the dog should be able to bond with you. People import adults all the time, people adopt adults all the time...if you put the time and work into it, and establish a sound relationship, you will develop a bond. The more you work with a dog, the stronger the bond will be, and that's regardless of the age of the dog. And, you can always find a young dog, less than a year old, that's not an adult yet.

Ditto! A lot of RRs I've seen in rescue are around 1-4 years old, so they're JUST passed being obnoxious babies (which RRs are IN FULL) but still PLENTY young enough to establish a great bond with.

RRs are not really a "working" breed, but they are busy bodies and will want to go with you and do whatever you're doing at all times. Mine absolutely has to be in whatever room I'm in, and will get up out of a deep sleep to follow me 20 feet to the bathroom... that said, an adult is also usually just fine spending all day snoozing at home while you're at work - as long as you promptly take them out when you come home. Some can become real couch potatoes as they mature, loving to nap most of the day, but they're always ready to leap to their feet for a walk. Mine does not love the heat - and I don't even live in a hot climate - but I think there's a lot of variation between individuals. The breed did after all originate as African hunting and farm dogs ...

Obviously, each personality is unique, but on the whole RRs are usually a pretty great mix of friendly or neutral with strangers (as in people you pass out on a walk) and quite protective in the home. I believe the breed standard stipulates their temperment be "aloof" with those not regarded as family. They're not aggressive attack dogs, and I wouldn't count on them to take a chunk out of a burglar, but they're big (males can be up to 100lbs), they have one hell of a bark (which they use sparingly), and they usually know just how much force to use to make their point, without being excessive. People definitely avoid me when I walk Oscar down the sidewalk, even though he usually has a pretty dopey look on his face and is clearly under complete control. Temperment aside, a big dog's presence alone is more of a deterrent than you'd think.

My male is very dominant, mostly in regards to other dogs (that doesn't make him aggressive, unless challenged) and that's been a learning curve for us (he's our first dog) but he's never even considered challenging US and knows his place in the house quite comfortably. Dominance is not uncommon in the breed, though I've never met another RR like Oscar, most are much more easy going. The cat issue is like most dog/cat issues - if the dog is raised and trained to respect cats, it'll be fine, if not, it may take some work to get them to coexist. Most RRs DO have a healthy prey drive and will chase anything small and furry - Oscar has chased cats before only to stop dead when they stop and just shove his nose into their fur. I'm not sure if his reaction would be the same today (we don't make a habit of letting him chase cats).

The big thing I can think of that WOULDN'T make RRs a good choice is your desire for an "eager to please" and really trainable dog. Don't get me wrong, every dog can be trained, but RRs are extremely independent minded creatures and you may end up working twice as hard to train the same things that a Dobe or a GSD would pick up right away. RRs are NOT STUPID, in fact I'd consider them a little TOO smart sometimes, they're just prone to extreme stubbornness. When an RR gives you the "what's in it for me" face, it's not looking for the simple gratification of pleasing it's owner ... they are uber food motivated though, so that helps. A solid recall is probably THE hardest thing for these dogs to nail. People who are serious about a 100% recall usually end up getting an e-collar for their RRs.... for even a well trained dog, the "hound" in them usually gets the best of them when they're off leash.

All that said, your situation sounds pretty good for an RR over the age of about 2. I'm completely in love with the breed and find my boy PERFECT for MY lifestyle. He's a total clown and full of expressive emotion, he's very serious when he needs to be, and he's low key for most of the day, except when we take our walks, runs and hikes - which is exactly what I need. He does shed lightly, and twice a year he sheds a LOT, but I swear, he doesn't smell unless he's just rolled in something, or he's wet. You're doing the very best thing by researching different breeds, and while most people clearly vote for their OWN breed of choice, you'll need to weigh the pros and cons for what fits YOUR life. Hopefully this discussion can shed good light on what breeds might fit that bill - there are more than enough dogs out there to chose from, one of them will be just right.

 Quote: leih merigian

I think, if you were to go with a working line GSD, you'd find yourself with more dog than you seem to be looking for, that would need more exercise and work to thrive than you seem able to devote to a dog at this time in your life.

I'm going to have to agree with Leih on this point as well - especially if you don't have a ton of time to spend with the dog everyday. Getting a serious working dog with hopes of training in a specific sport is a great goal and I think you should make it happen one day, but it's also something you need to plan for like having a kid - that much dog will demand a lot of your time and energy, so just make sure you are prepared to provide for it before you bring one home.

Cheers,
~Natalya

 Quote: Natalya Zahn

 Quote: leih merigian

One thing you have to watch out for is that most people are very committed to their own breed(s) and will tend to recommend them to others.

Not me, I try to dissuade people from getting a Ridgeback all the time!! We're a rare little club, and we like it that way..


~Natalya

DITTO!! I do not freely recommend my breed(s) of choice either.

Malinois are NOT for everyone and neither are Bloodhounds.
I would agree with Natalya about looking into a Ridgeback Rescue. Awesome dogs from what I know of them.

And, I will plug in here for a nice quality lab from a hunting/shooting litter but does not have what a hunter would want (low drives). They make excellent pets.

The Standard Poodle would get my vote as well.

 Quote: alyssa myracle

Seriously though, Standard Poodles are neat dogs. Smart, energetic, agile, and actually pretty intimidating barkers- they're much larger than a GSD, and have a mouth full of steak knives.

I second this suggestion as well - the few purebred Standard Poodles I've known have been really cool. Higher energy than an RR without being off the wall, more trainable, and VERY attached to their people. I wouldn't vote for any "doodle" mixes though... from my experience, they're all a bunch of nutsos.

~Natalya

Thank you everyone for all of the great information! It seems like everyone decided to reply at the same time

Well, based on what you guys have said, I'll move the standard poodle over to my "seriously considering" list and I will keep Ridgebacks there.

Natalya- I'm not looking for a dog with stellar obedience skills, so I'd probably do ok with an RR...I am pretty stubborn when I have to be and I do own cats, which have a similar temperment to most of the sighthounds I've studied, so maybe that would help prepare me.

I actually fund an RR breeder's website that is in my same state (and I like what she says about her temperment philosophy), so that is definately in the RR's favor. She is a "show" breeder, but I am not sure whether there are any purely working line RRs (lure coursing dogs I suppose).

Alex- Would the heat have a serious affect on a boxer if he was kept inside all day (in the AC) and taken for walks only in the evenings when it is warmer weather? It probably stays around 80f and below in the evenings here, so would a 45-60 minute walk in that heat be unrealistic for a boxer?

Also, I do love the way rotts look and have had good experiences with some of them (2 females I met in particular were very friendly and laid back). My only concern with a rott is that I've heard that the vast majority of males tend to be very dominant.

leih- Thank you for the information on the working lines dogs, I had thought that the higher energy / drives would be difficult in my situation. I know that finding a pet quality working line pup (with lower drives AND lower energy) would probably be a needle in a hay stack situation and I definately wouldn't want to end up with a dog that really wouldn't be happy in my situation. If only they bred lower energy show line dogs with stable and correct temperments (and good health) *sigh*

Carol- Although I hate to admit it, I just have never liked labs much... Not sure if it is solely their looks or their temperment or a combo of both.... My family's dog is 1/4 lab and (of course) looks just like a big black lab (well, a lab with a bigger bullier head and chest). Their genes must be somewhat dominant, as any lab mix I've ever seen looks very close to a pure bred lab.

After doing some more reading and from the great advice all of you have given, I have revised my original list...

Doberman
Rhodesian Ridgeback
Boxer
Standard Poodle
Rottweiler

Thank you all again for your information and advice! I want to make the most thought out and planned decision possible for both my and the dog's sake and your experiences and comments have really given me something to "chew on" so far.

Bethany

Hi: From what you are describing as the type of dog that you want, I would vote for the standard poodle. I love my GSDs, however my red standard poodle( Abbey) is only 6 months old and she is like no other dog that I have ever had. She is the easiest to train and groom (even though she has to be clippied every 7-8 weeks) she loves baths, and brushing,no shedding, very attentive. She loves everybody she meets, not scared of anything! I would definately recommend researching them.

 Quote: bethany anderson

... It's more the doggy "smell" that bothers me, verses any shedding, so if GSDs are as stink-free as a dobe or boxer, I guess I could add them to my list.

 Quote: bethany anderson

... she reccommended that I get a standard poodle ... I know they can be very smart, but I don't know if I'm up to having a "froo" dog. ...

IME, all dogs have a smell, just as all humans do. It's also my experience, given a healthy dog, that the smell that many people would find objectionable is usually a side effect of inappropriate food.

I haven't owned a Standard Poodle, but I know/have known a few. The "froo" factor is totally in your hands.

Most intelligence lists I have come across rank Poodles, Border Collies, and GSDs as the top three, in one order or another. Some put Borders at the top of "shedding" and Poodles at the top of "non shedding."


P.S. The Standard Poodles I have met were indeed excellent dogs. Of course, that's 100% anecdotal. I'm a GSD person, but I would put Standard Poodles on my short list for a companion dog.



Edited by Connie Sutherland (07/14/2008 07:30 PM)
Edit reason: p.s.