Quote: CJ Barrett

... And there’s that 30 lber again, in your quote. Elusive little beast but I'll bet he's cute. He's just not in my house...yet.

"Echo, who's got about 30 lbs on him"


It must have meant "30 more pounds."

 Quote: Connie Sutherland

PS Yes, glucosamine/chondroitin can cause constipation in some individuals.

Yeah Connie, it really had me worried there. We stopped the glucosamine right away. That's interesting to know that it does, in fact, cause constipation. Garrett has been on it for years (not near the dose - one every couple of days) without any problems. He can get a little loose every now and then but he doesn't get constipated.

Vince is a totally different beast though. Night and day, right from looks to temperament and everything in between.

He's on raw, has been since the day he came into my care, over 3 years ago now, and you guessed it, I don't really measure their food.

He had loosened up some last night but there was a bit of straining. Not the leg shaking though and it was much quicker. This morning was about the same. He got a turkey leg, some liver and about a handful of hamburger for breakfast and tonight he's pretty much back to normal. A bit firmer than usual but came out quickly and no straining. So I think we have it back under control.

We won't try that again, not for a while anyway. Maybe doc was right, not recommending anything, but she didn’t say anything about potential constipation.

Oh well, live and learn but I sure hate it when one of my boys has to take the brunt of one of my lessons. I'm having second thoughts on starting this licorice root too. We'd just like to do anything we can to help him along but it may be best to leave well enough alone.

Couldn't you just ramp up the dosage slowly as his bowels get used to it?

 Quote: Tresa Hendrix

Couldn't you just ramp up the dosage slowly as his bowels get used to it?

Yes. In this situation, I'm not sure I'd want to try it just yet. Or ..... maybe try it in a smaller dose along with something that naturally softens the stool. Maybe not extra muscle meat, so as not to throw off that ratio ..... you know, I can't think of a reason why a Colace-type (docusate) stool softener wouldn't be completely safe and gentle. Why not call the vet and explain the GAGs issue and ask about a stool softener along with it? Or consider to a change to liquid if you were using a powder.


Just a thought!

 Quote: CJ Barrett

 Quote: Connie Sutherland

PS Yes, glucosamine/chondroitin can cause constipation in some individuals.

That's interesting to know that it does, in fact, cause constipation.

Well, I've read that it's individual, in both dogs and humans. I've read of a few individuals who have gas, diarrhea, nausea, too.

But what form was it? I've read several times that liquid not only absorbs much better (like twice as well or more) but also triggers fewer G.I. side effects.

CJ, have you tried a big dollop of pure pumpkin? Before stopping the glucosamine, I would try upping a natural fiber in the diet first.

Also, MSM has shown to have a bowel loosening effect if given in a bit higher dose, that might be something to consider.

I am sure Connie is right though that every dog is different, and just finding out what works for Vince is the ticket.
I don't blame you though for getting worried, as the straining isn't good.
I have seen a bit of that in my female that I just started on glucosamine sulfate.
I just added more pumpkin and it seemed to do the trick.
just a thought.

 Quote: Tresa Hendrix

Couldn't you just ramp up the dosage slowly as his bowels get used to it?

I suppose we could but she just said to get the high dose into his system. A bit back, Tracey had alluded to tapering them off but the Dr. didn't mention anything about that either. We're going to connect in about another week so maybe she was going to say something then.

But with this bodily function being the worst of any of his movements right now, I don't want to do anything to risk something like this happening again.

 Quote: Connie Sutherland

why a Colace-type (docusate) stool softener wouldn't be completely safe and gentle.

I never thought about having some sort of stool softener of hand. That's a good idea.

Connie, did you ever think you would be recommending that. I can just see myself flapping this one off...you know just in case you have a dog with a sensitive GI tract that gets a herniated disc and in recovery you start him on glucosamine, against Dr’s recommendations and he gets constipated. OMG… I feel like such a loser.

Oh and it's a brand called Natural Factors, pill form, which I just put in his mouth. I can see where the liquid would probably absorb better. Another first, never heard about a liquid form, we've always had the pills around.

Joyce, I didn't start on the MSM or chondroitin yet. Just the glucosamine. We didn't want to overload his system with too much right away and were going to introduce the additional ones each week.

The pumpkin is a good idea. I think we're just going let his system stable out for a bit and we'll look at it again in a few weeks. I have all the stuff now, got a call that my Yucca is in.

Just wanted to give an update on Vince.

He's doing fantastic. We did the ladder exercise a few times and he started picking up his back feet nicely. Dragged the floppier foot over a few times at first but by the fifth day he was lifting all four nicely.

He's not perfect yet but did something yesterday that has me excited for a full recovery. We were heading up to the property which involves loading them in the vehicle. I had him out of the gate with me while I was getting the vehicle ready, hatch open and I was getting the ramp. When I turned around he was already in. He looked so happy staring back at me as if to say, come on, let's go.

There was no vocalizing out of frustration at the open hatch which told me he must have been feeling confident and no pain.

I’ve got him on a licorice twice a week. Just a small dose to get his body used to it and he seems to be doing fine there.

Haven't been back to vet but unless we decide to go with the CT I can pretty much explain to her what's happening.

The little lump on his spine isn't nearly as pronounced and the floppy foot is hard to flip over these days.

He's easily up to an hour of walking a couple of times a day and just an incredible companion in his down time. This injury has solidified our bond in more ways than one and has really shown me that obedience isn't just about exercise till you drop. These higher drive dogs can learn to control themselves and adapt to a more sedate way of being with a consistent approach and calmer activities to keep them occupied.

It's been a long hard road and we're not completely at the end of it yet but he's doing great. And we've had no new injuries in over 4 months. I think we may be out of our bad streak of luck, not to mention I'm just a tad wiser about the fact he does have limitations.

I'm super happy for you guys!

I love this statement:

"These higher drive dogs can learn to control themselves and adapt to a more sedate way of being with a consistent approach and calmer activities to keep them occupied."

Drivey pet dogs need to come with this label attached. Our shelters would have half the dogs in them.

I'm so happy to get this update, CJ. Such great news!