Dea, is the breeder in the US or Europe?

If the US, I wouldn't be surprised if its the person i'm thinking of. Did you pay $15,000 for the dog??? LOL.

Sorry to hear of your troubles. I've seen this happen first hand in a very similar situation, the dog I saw should have never been sold to the 20 year old girl that had to handle him. The girls mother got bitten in the hand for moving the dogs toy when cleaning the living room, and also required extensive hand surgery. The dog was a SchH3 titled dog and came off the bite when I hit him with a padded stick.

Unfortunately its not that uncommon. You need to work with a competent trainer that has experience not just in Schutzhund, but in working with possessive and aggressive dogs. This issue is not related to the dogs Schutzhund training, so finding a Schutzhund trainer is not as important as finding a trainer with experience with dogs that have these problems (but not a pet trainer, he must have working dog experience). I would perhaps see if there is someone in the region that has a background in one of the other protection/ring sports too. Many Schutzhund trainers seem to all have read the same book of tricks and do a fine job of screwing things up even more in a trial-and-error fashion. You need someone that can look at the dog and say "this is what we need to do," not "ok lets try this."

Dea, I sent you a PM.

Dea, correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the dog was bred in Europe and sold to a broker/breeder/trainer in the US who sold the dog to Dea.

Dea, my dog Carbon is from your breeder. I bought him as a pup, however; I didn't buy a trained import.

The dog I have now at 19 months is spectacular and I couldn't ask for more. However, like you, I had heard excellent things about the breeder and while I knew it was a pretty penny to be paid...multiple people had steered me towards them.

I have resources now that I didn't have then, however, and I do have to say that I would think twice before purchasing from them again. Not because my pup isn't everything I wanted and more, but because the business side of things leaves MUCH to be desired. Over the last 16 months I've heard A LOT of negative things regarding business practices at that kennel. I know every breeder gets some complaints, but it seems like I hear a new one every few weeks lately. I originally sang their praises but now I'm really starting to wonder what the heck is going on over there.

You are not the only one to have issues with the breeder--do a search on this forum or on Pedigree database, both for the kennel name and the breeder's name and you'll see what I mean.

The heart of the matter as I see it is that they import adult trained dogs and then want to do a quick turnaround in order to keep the profit up. The longer they keep the dog, the less their profit is due to feeding costs, vet costs, etc. Their turnover is very high. Part of the price that you pay for this is that when the breeder says "good with kids" or "good with cats" then that means that the breeder truthfully hasn't had the dog long enough to make that claim and I know for a fact that the dogs are NOT in a home environment when waiting to be sold--they live in kennels. Hard to make a claim about kids in such a short time in that situation.

Either that's what he was told when he imported the dog or the dog was great with HIS kid in what I'm sure was a short evaluation. When a dog is new to a place (either at the breeder or at your place), there is often a honeymoon phase and the dog could very well have been evaluated as being good with kids in that circumstance. Things change when a dog had time to become settled. That would explain why you posted that the dog was originally good with kids (in your satisfied customer post).

Secondly, different handlers will get different responses from dogs. They were right, IMO, in saying that they can't be responsible for furture handling of the dog. A dog like the one you have probably needs strong handling skills and experience. However, this is another failing of the kennel you purchased him from, IMO. They will give a dog to anyone with a full wallet and don't take much time to place them responsibly. Again...time costs money and decreases the profit.

I'm not saying that you're a weak handler...I'm saying that this particular dog may demand more of you than you were lead to believe.

As for the bite, it sounds like it was the dog going for the ball and getting your hand instead. Doesn't take away from the agony of what happened to you, but I've had the same thing happen to me to a lesser extent when I wasn't quick enough. Obviously no one can say for certain without seeing it happen and the internet is a horrible way to say if it was aggression or not, so take what I say with a grain of salt.

Final piece of advice to you--take it up with the Better Business Bureau (they've had complaints filed against them before--do a search on the BBB's website) or a lawyer. Do you have anything written that states that the dog is good with kids? Sell the dog back if you can or sell her to a working home...ask around at the club. You probably won't get what you paid for her, though.

OR, finally, if you're in any way attached to the dog...find a trainer. And one that has experience with SchH dogs. If you like the training director at your club, that might be a good place to start. I know you already have a trainer working with you, but if you don't feel confident...walk away. A bad trainer is worse than no trainer sometimes, to be honest.

My experience with the breeder was fine but of course it would be--I didn't have any issues crop up, I got a healthy amazing pup. But I know of many people who did have issues (health, behavior, training) that got a deaf ear. The more I hear the more I realize how lucky I was.

Good luck and I hope you'll keep us posted on this. Please feel free to send me a PM if you have any questions about my experience.

Thank you Amber and everyone!! Agreed, I'm in no way trying to "out" the kennel or owner. I'm sure since we've raised from puppies in the past, that all you've said makes absolute sense - the honeymoon period, etc. Raising from a pup obviously would have been the wiser decision.

Having said that, we can only move forward. If anyone has any ideas on re-homing, let me know. We want zero money; we just want a good home for her.

Rehoming a dog that has already bitten is difficult. People with the experience to handle the dog would only take her if the dog is great at the work.

The problem with giving a dog like this away for free is that you better be sure of who the recipient is, or the dog will then get sold to someone else and bounce around from home to home.

There are organizations out there that specifically rehome working dogs. David Frost posted a link to one just the other day in a thread on mixed breed police dogs.

Good luck.

 Quote: Mike J Schoonbrood

Rehoming a dog that has already bitten is difficult. People with the experience to handle the dog would only take her if the dog is great at the work.

The problem with giving a dog like this away for free is that you better be sure of who the recipient is, or the dog will then get sold to someone else and bounce around from home to home.

There are organizations out there that specifically rehome working dogs. David Frost posted a link to one just the other day in a thread on mixed breed police dogs.

Good luck.

As Mike said, if you choose to rehome, please be very careful who you relinquish the dog to. You have to find someone with a lot of experience with working dogs and their temperaments.

Here's the link Mike was talking about, that David Frost posted: http://www.gapdogs.org/ . Read David's post here: http://www.leerburg.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=196240#Post196240 to give you a better idea of what he was talking about.

I would not give this dog to a pet owner. You're telling an open forum that you are willing to give away, for no money, a dog that cost you $20,000. You may get lots of responses. Be careful. Best to check out David Frost's link.

I get dumber by the moment...I will check with Admins here before replying to any offers.

 Quote: Dea O'Hopp

...I will check with Admins here before replying to any offers.

Excellent idea. And don't forget to check out David's link. These are law enforcement officers that give dogs jobs, and dogs love to have a job to do.

 Quote: mike j schoonbrood

Rehoming a dog that has already bitten is difficult. People with the experience to handle the dog would only take her if the dog is great at the work.

True, but Dea said she thinks it was an "accidental" bite--she was amped for the ball and got her hand instead:

 Quote: dea o'hopp

It was not an attack in my opinion - the ball is on an 8" string and she got my hand, not the ball.

Evaluations are in order for sure, but if it wasn't an aggressive bite then the rehoming might not be so difficult. A good work or sport home might work. The kid issue can be probably worked on with an experienced handler.

 Quote: Sandy Moore

I would not give this dog to a pet owner. You're telling an open forum that you are willing to give away, for no money, a dog that cost you $20,000. You may get lots of responses. Be careful. Best to check out David Frost's link.

Ditto. And I wouldn't just drop it with the breeder, either. 20K is a lot of cake to just let go without a fight. Check the Better Business Bureau at least...it might be better than nothing and I know they have responded to complaints against them through the BBB.