the closest place that is not inhabited is about an hour drive. The city I live in and its suburbs are pretty vast/spread out..

I would never let this dog have free run off leash. His stubborn streak is a mile wide, and he doesn't recall well--he will look at me when called, but then continue walking...The only time(S) I have let him off leash was when we go camping/hunting deep in the desert or forest. He stays close out there, but not in the city.

Sounds like some detective work is in order.

I'm near the high school and in summer I sometimes use the track in the early a.m..

Boring, yes.


That recall, BTW -- that would be a crucial basic ob command to work on. I am NOT saying to let him off leash, and NO dog should be off-leash without a bulletproof recall, IMO, but I am saying that the recall is probably the number one basic ob command for safety.


Back to the exercise .... time for ingenuity. The perimeter of a shopping center can be both a good long unpopulated route and can serve as a spot for marker work with triggers visible but not within his reactive zone. The threads on desensitizing detail this need for areas outside his zone.

hmmm.. that is pretty ingenuitive :P never thought of that..
Thanks for all the great input by the way guys

Another exercise option: Treadmill! Do you have one? If not, you can find them cheap on craigslist. It's pretty simple to marker train.

That sure is a good exercise option!


For this dog, I hope that much of his structured exercise can come from "the pack-work -- the repetition of you, his leader, setting the pace and direction while he, the NON-leader, complies" on the structured fast-paced "leader in charge" power-walk.

Do you have a tennis court near? Sometimes I'll take mine there, shut the gates and they have a secure place to do whatever.

 Quote: aimee pochron

Do you have a tennis court near? Sometimes I'll take mine there, shut the gates and they have a secure place to do whatever.

Good idea. I forgot that I have often use tennis courts for early off leash traning, outside of my fenced yard, for young dogs.

I thought of the treadmill lol, but he has a strong adversion to mechanical buzzing sounds. I can run a blender, but other mechanical devices its a toss wether it will drive him nuts--I think he can hear things I don't from the machines..high pitched sounds are the worst I have noticed-- he has attacked with the intent to destroy (while they were on/in motion) a table saw, a tile cutter, cordless drill, weed wacker, shop vac, my pool pump motor when it was going out and making a high pitched ringing, and a toy RC car that was already broken/not moving...he's been reduced to barking over biting these things, but I would be hesitant about the cool treadmill toy :P

On a better note (his skeletons just keep falling out of the closet..) We have started to do obedience training right before we go on our walk, (since monday so only 3 days) and it seems to be helping? I don't know.. he has been alot more calm, he looks at people, but isn't doing his usual "HEY! What are you looking at?!" squaring up and trying to intimidate...he even helped me catch two stranded baby birds to put back in their nest without trying to eat them before I could grab them... Sounds to me like a definate dominance problem...as people have been saying all along :P

And thinking back, every day is a constant struggle... his stubborness I suppose would read more like a challenge for leadership then, perhaps? If this is the case and my observation is remotely correct, what (I know its hard to see through the internet) could I be doing wrong? Better?

His day starts and ends something like this:
I wake up, he and his sister (not really I just call her that) get out of the crates and go out back to go potty in the back yard. They have to sit and wait 3 feet from the door so I can get by, and are not allowed to bolt out the door, they have to wait for the 'out' command while still sitting.

Food is prepared (same protocol for the second feeding before bed time). Bowls on the counter. I let the dogs in one at a time. Again they have to sit outside, and wait for me to tell them who I want to come in and when. My female comes in first, she sits and waits for me to set the bowl down, continues to sit until I tell her 'Get it.' Then as she Eats I get my boy. Same process, but he gets to eat in the laundry room seperate from her--they don't fight over food, I just seperate them anyway.

Then the dogs get put in their room, and the doggy door is opened so they can go inside or out while I am at work. My hours can be between 6-10 hour shifts depending on how many patients ect. So I don't want them in a crate for 10 hours if no one can get home to let them out to go potty (my new schedual will change this, I will be able to let them stay in the crate while I am at work, and out when I am not).

When I get home it's training school for the pitbull (shes learning the golden rule "leave it" right now since she loves to share your food with herself if you are not looking/leave it unattended), and a walk. Then the same for Aries who takes the longest to wear out (I was just jumping straight to the walk, now it's back to school).
When I am home the dogs are not allowed on furniture unless invited, and get to chew on their bones with us if they are being calm while we watch a movie. I try to do one on one hanging out, because the pitbull gets really playfull with him in the house, and its a little much for me to handle all the time at once.

sooo.. thread search ideas?

On a better note (his skeletons just keep falling out of the closet..) We have started to do obedience training right before we go on our walk, (since monday so only 3 days) and it seems to be helping? I don't know.. he has been alot more calm, he looks at people, but isn't doing his usual "HEY! What are you looking at?!" squaring up and trying to intimidate...he even helped me catch two stranded baby birds to put back in their nest without trying to eat them before I could grab them... Sounds to me like a definate dominance problem...as people have been saying all along :P

And thinking back, every day is a constant struggle... his stubborness I suppose would read more like a challenge for leadership then, perhaps? If this is the case and my observation is remotely correct, what (I know its hard to see through the internet) could I be doing wrong? Better?



1. Ob training (short but frequent sessions) is definitely the basis for what we are all talking about, so kudos!

Have you found the threads with the search term desensitize and desensitizing?



2. "Stubborn" is a human construct, IMO. Yes, testing for leadership is what I would assume. This dog has a ton of unearned freedom, IMO.

Are you thoroughly familiar with NILIF?

NILIF involves much more than sit before food, for me. It means I own the world and the dog must work for everything he wants.

Also, I precede the dog everywhere. I own the floor. The dog moves out of the way; I don't. I walk "through" a dog who is in my way. I don't invite a pushy dog onto my furniture until we are clear on who the boss is. If the dog likes petting, he does a command for it. If he wants a walk, he must sit or down first.

Here is a kind of simple overview (and you will find much deeper discussions here) with some good points: http://k9deb.com/nilif.htm

I'd skip the class and the dog park, but the rest is basic.

QUOTE:
"The NILIF program should not be a long, drawn out process. All you need to do is enforce a simple command before allowing him access to what he wants."