Hey guys,

I have been out of school for awhile, can you put some of these explanations in layman's terms? Also maybe a shorten things up a bit. I can't train dogs and read these long winded debates.

Thanks,
Brad

Dennis wrote:"Have you?"

Nope, certainly not, BUT I'm not the one starting a club and putting myself up as TRAINING DIRECTOR now am I?

Good luck homeboy, I wish you and you're new club well. Really, that's not a jab either.

Hope to see you showing your stuff in competition in the future.

Sadly, while attempting to read these incredibly long posts, my head exploded...
*snicker*

While I see Van Camps point. I don't necessarily agree. If you have the right people the club will be a success. If everyone is on the same page. Also, if people are willing to continue to learn and continuely seek out knowledge from people who have done more than them. Especially in Iowa. There are not many people who have done much in the World of SchH. So as long as the TD continues to grow in the sport I don't have a problem. Where I see a problem, is when people decide they know it all in the world of Dog training(which happens all the time). You are either growing or dying. Fact of Life.

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Will, LOL!!! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Hi all,
More clubs needed in Iowa??? Well, there are 2 STRONG clubs working under the "major" dog club organizations. One WDA club in Waterloo, and a
Schutzhund USA club in Des Moines.There are other small groups working on their own.
Some questions for Dennis Hasley ( first let me say, I am one of the people that left his group and started a new group in Des Moines, our new club had one member go to the Nationals this year and get HOT female handler, another club member laid the tracks at the Nationals....)

1. Dennis, how can you call your group "new"? They have been a listed forming club with Schutzhund USA for YEARS. They have had one dog get a BH in all those years and NO SCH titles. They have never had a forming trial. So "new"
is not correct..
2. Do you still make dogs immediately "out" the sleeve so they don't ruin your ONE bite sleeve?
3. Do you own a dog that is training for Schutzhund?
4. Last I knew you didn't attend regular helper seminars to keep up your skills, Do you even own Bite pants? The dogs in your club have never even had a Stick hit after 5 years of training.!
5. We stopped by your group one day and they were running the dogs AROUND the jump instead of over it.. they said this was one of Dennis's training methods?? AROUND the jump...come on Dennis!!
6. You say you will get someone a BH in 12 weeks or less... Why haven't your current club members done this?
7. You also mention "free" resources. Did you quit charging the club a fee each week for your training? Last I knew, they paid you!
8. Are you a Schutzhund USA, DVG, WDA, or AWDF member? Do you have a helper scorebook? Are your club members all members of these groups?
9. Have you ever been to any seminars, or training sessions in this area? Have your club members?
10. The members of your club don't use kennels at training, all of the dogs hang out together on the ground during training and bite work.
What is the reasoning behind this?
11. Do you have, or does ANYONE in your club own a Schutzhund USA rulebook?
12. Why don't your club members ever visit other clubs in the area and show off their dogs that you have helped them train?
13. How many of your club members have ever been to a Schutzhund trial?
14. How can you comment on our club in Des Moines? You have NEVER EVER been to one of our training sessions. NONE of your members have EVER
been to one. We had a dog go to the Nationals and place high, we had a club member lay tracks at the nationals, we have dogs working on BH, SCH1, SCH2... SO what are we doing so wrong ? Come visit our club , then you can post informaion about us on the web.
I also see Chad Stahl, ( who is an EXCELLANT helper!) is working on a new club here. He would not even commit to training with our group twice a week. He has years of great experience and yet , instead of join a growing group he starts another club... COME on people, lets put Iowa on the map in Schutzhund, but we don't need 50 clubs to do it!!

*sigh*
Another one time poster who can't even bother to post with his real name as required by board policy. I wish people would have the balls to at least identify themselves when making personal attacks on others.
This was not made in defense of Dennis, whom I don't know from Adam. I'm just a little discouraged at people's reading skills when they sign up for the board. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Never mind, poster fixed it I see. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

Wow, Cathi, strong opinions. I don't have a problem with there being another club in Iowa. Why should you? If the your club is so great(don't know, only been to DSM once, and that was quite the showing... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> ), why are you so threatened when somebody makes comments they didnt agree with your club. Personality conflicts. Happens all the time. I am not jumping on either side here. Just curious. I applaud your efforts to make it a go in DSM when all the others failed. Keep it up. As far as the club in Waterloo, I had a personality conflict with that individual. So I choose not to go there. I think it is great people are starting to be able to get choices. Also, I don't think I would characterize the groups in DSM or Waterloo as strong. Just me though.

We don’t need this for certain. But to be fair I will say I think Ashley is a fine trainer of her dog but I think to say your club did most of her work would be a little off.

I have already stated the group had some differences in training direction and so they split. But to be fair I will say I think Ashley is a fine trainer of her dog but I think to say your club did most of her work would be a little off I think.

I have also stated the group has struggled here with low drive dogs you work with what you have or get another dog. But they do have the books and are members of USA and will continue to be members as far as I know they like the magazine. The dogs get stick hit if he or she is fully developed with prey and slamming the sleeve as if the stick alone really means anything. This group for all purposes is new because until we had dogs with drive or people to bring the group in we had to simply learn with what they had and I am now focusing full steam to the objective of building a club in the proper way. I have never claimed they would be great dogs I rather told them the truth and so they know it. The truth is now a few of them have a chance if they commit to the training but time will tell.

Yes I have an instruction program that will in 12 meet BH requirements. Hell My AKC people can do it is 6 so it seems safe to give all 12 weeks to mark. I was not officially part of the club but I was their trainer in other post when the topic came up. I have been working on some long-term goals with my training program and future building and so on. You know “Post divorce shake out” and refocus sometime takes time to find new directions. So…like I have stated I have been for the last 3 years. Training and studying and growing new business areas and so on. At 30 I feel I have time to make more enemies if it comes to this but I hope not.

The club is looking at DVG because they feel it encompasses less WHO DID and HOW DID or WHAT DID and focuses more on the dog the owner and their relationship. Some did not care to win the nationals some just had dogs and wanted to do something worthy. How as a trainer could I argue this point?

Once people understand that schutzhund is but one part of dog training they will be better off at least as trainers. I have not been with the club for 5 years and at any rate ALL of our dogs are new or less than one year old save 1 who has his BH and could get his SCHI is his owner wants to kick it in gear on the tracking and he knows it.

There seems no point in explaining more about what time with this group will tell. I think we have a good start because not only do we have a few good prospect with the drives I specified, they have had a chance to learn and make some training mistakes regroup and fix them and by doing so they have learned. I have not been eager to jump both feet into schutzhund until I completed my business objectives meeting other commitments in my life.

As far as Mr Sthal goes: A professor at ISU in the Animal Science Dept who has been involved in Sch since the early/mid 90's and was the head training helper at the Raleigh Sch Club (USA) from 94-96 (USA Judges' Floyd Wilson's club at the time) He also did the helper work for the SchI's at the 95 SE regionals in Opelika, AL. To me he seems qualified to know why not to train with one group over another and has every right to form any club or join any group he wants.

I would go down your list point to point and destroy it but I will let you keep this list on a public forum for personal entertainment. No sense in having you upset, you have a trial coming up, but we are going forward. I do wish you the best of luck.
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