Quote:

Laura,
I've said this several times in the past, but I think it bears repeating - when you go to look at a dog, take the best decoy/ helper along that you can get your hands on and have him test the dog to *your* satisfaction. Test the potential ppd strongly in defense and civil work ( look carefully at the dog's reaction to civil aggression by a stranger wearing no equipment, that will be important for a ppd, needless to say )

Hope that helps!

I did exactly this on Friday, with the only decoy I know. He works with police dogs. Even though I have been hanging here and reading everything since last summer, still (of course) he saw everything I missed. It was *extremely* educational, and I would've been lost on my own.

This sounds like a very important point. I'm very grateful for youralls advice, and I think it's wise to change my plans a bit.

I have an idea as to what to do in terms of finding a local decoy. I'm going to start that process tomorrow, with a trip to this country's police force dog training center. I feel pretty sure that I'll be able to network with the people there and in the end, I will have located a decoy that is willing to work with me privately.

It may be possible that the people there will be able to help me find a ppd that is available locally, which means that the decoy would be available to test it. That sounds like ideal option #1, if it exists. However, if that isn't the case, it does not sound realistic to expect my newly-met decoy buddy to fly out of the country with me to check out some dogs.

In that event, perhaps the wisest thing to do would be to buy sight-unseen from someone who seems like a dead-sure bet at working with these kinds of dogs and placing them. Frankly, I was thinking about k9conceptsofgeorgia.com, and some of the other businesses I learned about from this board. The decoy would be able to take a look at the dog with me after it arrived, and give me the basic coaching on handling these dogs that I was originally hoping to get from the dog's trainer/seller.

Hows that for a plan? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

An unrelated question: Is there a difference in the cold weather (0F) resistance of the belgian malinois and the german shepherds?

--Laura

Wait...whoa.....


While I think the K9 Concepts of Georgia guys are pretty good ( <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> ) you live in Europe, where I wish I did!!

You have access to more good dogs in a smaller region than we here in the States can only dream off - honestly, you can get a good dog there if you just take your time and establish some contacts slowly there - heck, head out to a nearby ( believe me, there will be one nearby to you, you lucky dog!.... ) SchH club and make your intentions known, you'll likely hear all about the local litters on the ground or good green dogs available.

A serious club with good dogs would likely work your dog privately towards ppd training, and you might even fall in love with schH training, which can be a good strong basis for ppd work with a good dog and the proper decoy/ handler.

Take your time, be open to new things, and it'll end up fine for you!

 Quote:

Laura,
I've said this several times in the past, but I think it bears repeating - when you go to look at a dog, take the best decoy/ helper along that you can get your hands on and have him test the dog to *your* satisfaction. Test the potential ppd strongly in defense and civil work ( look carefully at the dog's reaction to civil aggression by a stranger wearing no equipment, that will be important for a ppd, needless to say )

Hope that helps!

Well stated Will, civil aggression in PPd is a key element.. I'm sure will would agree, it's all in the Eye contact <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Hello all,

Wanted to give you an update (you'll see I've been paying attention <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> )

I met with people from a local working Belgian Malinois club today! I made contact with them by first talking to the people at the police dog school, and then making a phone call to a person who turned out to be one of the people in the club who is a really experienced decoy/trainer. They breed and train their dogs for competition, and they seem to understand the industry (if it's called an industry) well, and do things with ppd dogs as well as competition.

Initially, the person I have been talking with explained that it is difficult to get a good and finished ppd dog in this country because people who get good dogs tend to hang onto them (its a small country population-wise), and that we would probably have the best luck finding the dog I want using his contacts in Holland. But then, his friend (also a trainer/decoy person) said that there was a local woman with a good dog that he trains that is up for sale. Both of the people know the dog (the one guy is the dog's regular trainer) and had even on one occasion been at the woman's house with the dog loose. They think he sounds like just what I'm asking for, and that I may have gotten a bit lucky with the timing. The dog is 5 years old and was moved toward being a ppd dog instead of competition because they found that dog sucks at tracking (but is great at the defense work). He's been used for breeding and had 4 litters sired so far.

The description of the dog sounds like what I want, and is also in line with what I would expect would match a good ppd dog: its a male dog with a strong dominant streak, a "serious" dog, and so on.

I think I should continue to take the advice of the people on this board though, and ask that the decoy person help me test the dog, IE: "Test the potential ppd strongly in defense and civil work ( look carefully at the dog's reaction to civil aggression by a stranger wearing no equipment)".

I do have the hunch that they are giving me good advice on this dog - it's not a huge bunch of people, they know I will be active in their club, and the way the culture is here is such that people do not bullshit as much as they might in some other places. The dynamics of the situation feel good.

So... that's how it's going, and its looking pretty good at the moment. I will know in the beginning of May if I'm going ahead right then or, exactly what my timing will be.

While I was there, I also got to watch dogs do bite work, and saw some practice at the competition type stuff. It was certainly interesting!

Lastly, a question to toss to you guys regarding this piece of advice:

"look carefully at the dog's reaction to civil aggression by a stranger wearing no equipment"

What's a good reaction vs. bad, or will it be obvious?

I wrote something that sounds stupid.

"The description of the dog sounds like what I want, and is also in line with what I would expect would match a good ppd dog: its a male dog with a strong dominant streak, a "serious" dog, and so on. "

Dominance isn't a trait related directly to ppd dogs suitability and I know that. I shouldn't have put it in that sentance, and the edit function on this board is disabled so I can't fix it. It was just a trait about the dog that got my attention as something that I will have to manage correctly if I do get this dog.