OK, This post is going to be long and I request your patience.

Most of you know that I have 3+1 dogs. I have Bommi, Helga and kaiser and then Kari. I was supposed to be holding on to Kari for a few months but those months have turned into an year and half now.

Now, I have some one in my village who is very very close to me wanting to take Kari. He works for us and has his own 1 acre plot with a house in the middle. He has farm land and grows his own food and on top he makes about 150 USD a month. He is not a wealthy person (neither am I , but comparatively speaking)but can provide the basic needs for him, like food and basic medical care. He has a wife who will be at home always and has met kari many times in my house. And a son who attends 8th grade and he too has met kari. I have also made a deal with him that if he ever thinks he cant keep kari, he should give Kari back to me.


I would never have thought of giving up kari, but of late I think he is not happy being with me. here is why.

1) He will run up and greet me when I come home and all that, but then he will walk away and curl up in a corner. Even when I go down to my garden to pet all my dogs, he will come up only 30% of the time to get petted. And even then once I pet him for a few minutes he will walk away.

2) When ever I ask him to do any thing , like sit , or down it will stress him a lot and he will give out calming signals like yawning and avoiding eye contact etc. He cannot handle even the slightest of compulsion. I have tried a few times to make him work though his stress and he goes down hill very fast. It also bothers me a little bit, that I am not able to get into his head.

3) When I give all my dogs some snacks, the other three will gather around me like kids and try to scheme me into giving them more, Kari, usually stays in the corner and I have to call him and give him the treats.

4) I have been trying to marker train him for an year now, Of course I do not do any meaningful work with him as even the slightest bit of disapproval (Ex, I ask him to sit and he lies down and I say "no" as a negative marker and that no can make him heart broken). I would not say that I am an expert but I do pretty well with my other three and I do not think there is any problem with my technique.

5) It is just that he does not think there is anything of much value he can gain by working me. He does not "buy" the concept that I can be useful to him. Even while marker training he will rather hunt for bits on the floor rather than getting them from me. The only time I get any meaningful attention from him is during his feeding time.

6) I have been dreaming of taking a mongrel like him to an obedience show and putting on a great show. But those are just my aspirations and I do not hold Kari responsible for them. I must say that I am a bit disappointed in that aspect BUT god's honest truth is that I love him like my other dogs (like my children).


7) He is normal and does other normal doggy things with his housemates and has a good time. But the moment I am in the picture, he seems to loose a bit of that joy. Not always, but when I ask them to calm down or any interaction from me. When I see this it makes me very sad and guilty.

8) Most importantly , I have 3 other dogs and I run a very tight ship . I cannot allow one dog to keep acting as he pleases as it will destroy the whole system of discipline. So I am forced to ask him to do certain things.

9) Some times I will call him and he will ignore me. I do not have the personality to just say that is OK. Then I have to say "NO" "Kari come here" and he will come with his head slung low and eyes diverted. I have never punished him for coming to me or any thing like that.

I am very concerned about his happiness. However he has to live within certain minimal rules and regulations. His happiness cannot be at the expense of breaking down of law and order in my household.

What is life if you cannot be happy, man or dog it makes no difference.

I REALLY DON'T WANT TO GIVE HIM AWAY because he is my child, but I don't want him to feel bad inside when he is with me.

WHAT TO DO???

I may not be the best one to anwser you, but Kari sound a lot like my Dexter.

The less I do with Dexter the more he will give me. When he show some interest I will do a very short marker session and stop while he still is interested in me and literally run from him.
That kind of leave him hanging but not stress.

I reward him for anything also that he offer and can be shaped into something. I had to find a good treat for him. Craker Barrel orange sharp cheddar, got to be orange!

Has far as giving him that your the one who should know what is the best for him.

It's a tough one and only you can really decide what is right. I think the first issue you might have to address is he as happy as he can be? Would he be happier with your friend? Maybe or it may be, that this is just as good as it gets for him....

I have re-homed dogs that just did not seem to be doing well here, that something was missing for them because of their personality.

Never an easy decision......

I think some dogs are just like that, especially some hounds. Just not all that interested in what you have to offer. Those dogs perhaps are not good dogs for you (or me!) but they can be great dogs for folks who don't want to have tons of personal interaction with their dog, they just want a dog in the yard who may occasionally bark at a stranger and that's it.
I'd let him go to the new home, and feel good about placing him well. He may be happier with less pressure to be something that he's not.

Every time you make rules you have to balance it with enough motivation to keep the dog wanting to work for you. It sounds like Kari might need more/better motivation and possibly softer handling.

Let your friend play with Kari and see how they fit together.

My pointer bitch is the one out of my 4 who can take or leave attention/affection, she is perfectly happy to be part of the pack, but I am certain she would not mind a jot if she was on her own, she has been like that since a pup, and in the structure of the dogs at least, is the one they all defer to.

Has Kari always been indifferent or is it since the pups arrived?

Also, I think you said he is quite happy with the pack, though not bothered about hanging out with you?? Is he like that with all people??

What I know about your regime with your dogs, you have a great bond with them, so the lack of response to discipline must be irksome, (something else he has in common with my pointer) but if he is happy enough to mooch about with the pack, and if he eats/pee's/poo's normally,( i.e. isn't unwell) and rests peacefully to sleep, he may be content with just 'being'...

You know your dogs best Ram, I guess you will have to go with your gut feeling, but I can only imagine how upsetting it is for you when you clearly love him so much.

Ana>> There is nothing of interest to him I have to offer. Unless I with hold food and feed with clicker. I have tried it and it works for a few days but once I stop with holding his rations, we regress.


It is just that he does not think there is anything interesting about me. Or to put it in an other way he does not think that he can work me.

Unless the dog thinks it's behaviour can influence my behaviour towards them there is no meaningful relationship.


Tracy>> He has been like that since he was a baby, but I have been noticing it more and more lately. I don't need him to come upto me and be with me, all I am worried about is if he is unhappy.

It is not about him not being obedient or trainable, I am perfectly happy to have him as he is as long as he is not sad inside.


Ram

Do you think maybe he is just a very chilled out boy who just can't be arsed?

There are dogs like that just like some people, if he isn't off his food, or pining, or being hassled by the other dogs, and if you are happy for him to just be himself, rather than all the other stuff you do with the remaining 3, maybe you are being hard on yourself and feeling guilty for no reason, just a thought

May be I am being selfish and emotional, but it makes me very sad when I see all my other 3 dogs jostling for attention and space around me while he is in a corner.

I will post a video of him tomorrow and that may show you what I mean.

Not selfish or emotional, just uncommonly kind and devoted to your dogs