Okay, I am having an issue with a person who had me stop by and see his dog and to figure out why he is the way he is. He obtained a GSD mix from some people who needed to get rid of him because he was aggressive. YIKES.....he is one of those "sneak up behind you and nail you everytime" dogs. You do not see him or hear him coming until he is attached to you butt or calf muscle. I told them to either kennel him or put him down. He got the dog 1.5 years ago and just now wants to fix the problem. IMO, the dog is going to cause a lawsuit. I am not one to jump on destroying a dog but he is VERY aggressive when your not looking and the thing is he stays out of site so you cannot see him when you pull in. He will not confront you head on. Since I have never seen this type of behaviour in person before, does anyone know if there is anything we can do to help him or is he a lost cause???? He is 4 years old, intact. He is fine with the family members. He has bitten several times. When I got out of my vehicle he came at me but I always kept facing him and he would advance no further.

Thanks
Carol

Hi Carol, I have been an assistant to a professional dog trainer who follows very similar practices that you would see in Ed's videos, and what you would read on his web site. This is also the first time I'v given my two cents on any Web Board.

If this were my dog, the first thing I'd do is purchase a remote/electric collar. I'd condition the dog to the collar, like Ed mentions in the training articles on his website, and then I'd get a friend or family member to help me out.

I'd set the dog up so that he doesn't know I'm watching. I would have the dog in position where he'd try to sneak out and bite. I'd have my friend pull up in the drive way, get out of the car, and walk slowly to the house. The split second before the dog sneaks up on my frind and gets ready to bite her, I'd pop the dog on a high setting with the remote collar. Repeat that a few times, and the dog will think twice about biting a person's back side ever again.

I hope this helps. I know that's what I'd do if that were my dog.

Best of Luck to you,
Mundy

I thought of that too and he states he tried it and the dog ran through it (even on setting 5 which I am having a hard time believing). This tells me that the dog gets more aggressive on pain stimuli if I am reading and listening to the videos correctly......please tell me if I am mistaken.
I guess I should also say that IMO this is someone that should not have a "pet". Long hours or days at a time away, dog is left unsupervised, kids probably tease it a little. I do not know them real well. I have been doing presentations with my dogs and have been learning all I can via Leerburg and my other trainers and these are really not people I would necassarily associate with under any other circumstances. But since the presentations I get more and more calls for advice being in such a small town. I am more than willing to get him information but really do not want to get into the habit of "helping" people with dogs like this. I have two dogs for SAR Work that I need to concentrate on myself. I appreciate the help though. I am just stumped at this dogs behaviour......... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />

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....even on setting 5 which I am having a hard time believing..

What brand e-collar? My GSD is more than capable of ignoring level 7 (max setting, i sure as heck cant hold my finger on it on continuous stim!) on an Innotek ADV-300 when he's determined to ignore me. But lately something's been screwy with the collar, I hit it on low level n my dog jumps up and yelps, even when theres a good contact between the prongs and his neck, so I don't use it anymore assuming it's broken, and will be buying a 2-dog TriTronic e-collar in anticipation of my 2nd dog - it'll be a year and a half before I begin using an e-collar (assuming I get a pup within the next 6-8 months) but at least it'll be there when I need it <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

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I thought of that too and he states he tried it and the dog ran through it (even on setting 5 which I am having a hard time believing). This tells me that the dog gets more aggressive on pain stimuli if I am reading and listening to the videos correctly......please tell me if I am mistaken.

Are you 100% certain the collar probes are making contact with the skin? Some ecollars have optional probe extenders to go through thicker fur. Those, or shaving a contact spot into the skin may make a large difference. Failing an ecollar, I would go with that above method except using a long line and a properly fitted prong. The ecollar would be best. Do the people do proper groundwork with the dog?

Carol, Where are the owners when he does this sneak attack? Does he do this in their presence? Is he left outside to his own devices to greet unsuspecting company?

Debbie

I agree with Diana. I'd have these people double check the contact to the E collar. I can't imagine a dog being that geard into drive to bolt through a correcton on the highest setting, just so it could bite somebody in the butt. It doesn't sound to me like this dog is retaliating the collar, it sounds to me, like he isn't feeling it.

Mundy

Debbie, The owners are present at times and other times they are inside or not at home. The dog is strictly an outdoor dog left loose on a huge amount of ranch tyoe property.
I asked about the collar tonight and although he did not have the box or the collar totell me the name of it he did say that he bought it about 3 months ago and it is tight on the dogs neck. Price he paid was about $300.00 at a sporting goods store called Scheels and he did say that it worked, it zapped him pretty good. I have not been present when the dog is worked in the collar so I cannot say if it is fitted right or that it is even very strong or that they are using the collar correctly. They just asked for my help and I am looking into it for them to give them some ideas. The dog comes from a housing project area and was allowed to always run loose and from what I saw, is a rather shy dog that just bites out of fear. This assumption comes from the rear only attacks. Thanks for all your help I will print these posts and let him read them. Thanks

I use 2 methods to check contact between the collar and my dog....

1) hold my hand on his neck near the collar and hit it on the lowest level, if I feel a muscle move I know it's making contact.

2) depending on the level, I can see his fur move around his neck as his muscle spasms from a distance. when he has his nose in the grass and is totally determined to not recall, I can hit constant stim at highest level and the only reason it breaks his focus is because after 2 or 3 seconds he'll instinctively start to scratch at his neck, which means his nose is out of the grass, which means I can let go of the e-collar and recall him and he'll finally listen. This isn't a frequent occurance, but it has happened on several occasions. I hate using stim that high on him, it's an absolute last resort.

A good yard dog when you live in the country is certainly an asset! However, a sneaky biter can certainly be a problem!

They are going to have to be very consistent with their corrections for this. Setting him up to give a correction and keeping him in an outdoor kennel or crate when they are not around is a must until they get this under control,as he needs to be corrected every single time he does it. He may well be a fraidy cat but he is brave enough to sneak up and bite so can do some damage. The bad thing is that everytime he gets away with this he most likely gets a little braver,so the the probability of this escalating into something worse is high. Of course, I guess it's hard to get much worse than having a dog sneak up on you and bite you!!! The success of changing this behavior depends on how hard the owner is willing to work at it.

Some basic obedience would help this dog a bunch.

Good luck,
Debbie