Doug Dieker wrote 05/01/2006 11:51 PM Confirming Schutzhund titles #105388 - 05/01/2006 11:51 PM
Doug Dieker Webboard User Reg: 04-26-2006 Posts: 7 Loc: Offline	Sorry if this is a stupid question but how does one confirm that a dog has received its various titles? If a dog is titled SchH 1, for example, is it included on the pedigree, or is there a separate title the dog receives, or how does that work. Thanks.
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sandhi k. davis-bunch wrote 05/02/2006 02:11 AM Re: Confirming Schutzhund titles [Re: Doug Dieker ] #105389 - 05/02/2006 02:11 AM
sandhi k. davis-bunch Webboard User Reg: 03-07-2006 Posts: 48 Loc: california Offline	on german and most european pedigrees the titles are listed. on USA pedigrees(United Schutzhund Clubs of America), titles are listed. the AKC does not list european titles, or working titles achieved under other organizations. one way to confirm would be to ask the dog owner to see the scorebook. any dog titled in USA or DVG must have a scorebook and all titles attempted, pass or fail, are recorded there. your friend in training, sandhi
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Keith Jenkins wrote 05/02/2006 07:34 AM Re: Confirming Schutzhund titles [Re: sandhi k. davis-bunch ] #105390 - 05/02/2006 07:34 AM
Keith Jenkins Webboard User Reg: 08-25-2003 Posts: 209 Loc: Virginia Offline	Quote: on german and most european pedigrees the titles are listed. on USA pedigrees(United Schutzhund Clubs of America), titles are listed. the AKC does not list european titles, or working titles achieved under other organizations. one way to confirm would be to ask the dog owner to see the scorebook. any dog titled in USA or DVG must have a scorebook and all titles attempted, pass or fail, are recorded there. your friend in training, sandhi Be very careful about how much face value you give some of the titles listed on some of the Euro pedigrees. Even with FCI stamped pedigrees the info can be incorrect. Keith Jenkins Eli SchH3,FH,StP.3,BH,TD Breitta v. Schwarzen Kobold BH,TR1 Argus vd Aunkst SchH3,BH,AD-2011 USRC National SchH3 Champion
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Doug Dieker wrote 05/02/2006 05:48 PM Re: Confirming Schutzhund titles [Re: sandhi k. davis-bunch ] #105391 - 05/02/2006 05:48 PM
Doug Dieker Webboard User Reg: 04-26-2006 Posts: 7 Loc: Offline	Thank you for the reply. The next question I have is: If the titles are indicated on the pedigree, do you send the pedigree in someplace to have them incuded, or do you simply have the judge handwrite it at the time of the trial? Thanks again.
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chris bettin wrote 05/03/2006 08:56 AM Re: Confirming Schutzhund titles [Re: Doug Dieker ] #105392 - 05/03/2006 08:56 AM
chris bettin Webboard User Reg: 03-28-2003 Posts: 156 Loc: Offline	each dog has a scorebook issued by the organization the handler belongs to/competes in. it has all of their identification information in it (name, sire, dam, tattoo, registry #'s, etc.) the scores and titles are entered in the scorebook by the judge/trial secretary, who also send copies of the trial paperwork to the organization in question. the book stays with the dog if the dog changes ownership, etc.
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Beth Fuqua wrote 05/03/2006 01:49 PM Re: Confirming Schutzhund titles [Re: chris bettin ] #105393 - 05/03/2006 01:49 PM
Beth Fuqua Webboard User Reg: 02-25-2004 Posts: 559 Loc: Joliet, IL Offline	I'm still really new at this, but for reasons I won't get into here, I got curious about WHERE trials were done, when done in Europe. I found it interesting to see scorebooks for SchH3 dogs where every title was earned on a home field, and sometimes with little variety in judges. That doesn't necessarily mean the dog is weak or bad, but it's something I would consider as a "red flag" worthy of more investigation about the dog. Beth http://www.JolietSchutzhund.com
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Keith Jenkins wrote 05/03/2006 03:13 PM Re: Confirming Schutzhund titles [Re: Beth Fuqua ] #105394 - 05/03/2006 03:13 PM
Keith Jenkins Webboard User Reg: 08-25-2003 Posts: 209 Loc: Virginia Offline	You need to consider that the vast majority of dogs titled are done at home clubs whether from here or Europe. Not sure what a fair estimate would be but I'd be willing to bet 90% plus of dogs titled are club dogs and nothing more. Nothing wrong with that, just that it is what it is. Keith Jenkins Eli SchH3,FH,StP.3,BH,TD Breitta v. Schwarzen Kobold BH,TR1 Argus vd Aunkst SchH3,BH,AD-2011 USRC National SchH3 Champion
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Will Rambeau wrote 05/03/2006 04:25 PM Re: Confirming Schutzhund titles [Re: Doug Dieker ] #105395 - 05/03/2006 04:25 PM
Will Rambeau Moderator Reg: 01-25-2003 Posts: 5983 Loc: Idaho Offline	I'vre learned through out the years to rely on my personal observations of watching a dog work rather than relying on a recorded title. There is plenty of cheating going on in dog sports, and you'll find that some ( maybe many ) titles are awarded for a bribe or as a judge to judge favor. The best way is just to ignore the titles and have the seller do an full SchH routine on the dog from start to finish with you watching closely - that will answer your questions about a dog better than looking at it's titles. The Fetz dog: http://www.leerburg.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/79673/page/25
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Sue DiCero wrote 05/03/2006 05:40 PM Re: Confirming Schutzhund titles [Re: Keith Jenkins ] #105396 - 05/03/2006 05:40 PM
Sue DiCero Webboard User Reg: 07-12-2001 Posts: 348 Loc: Nashville, TN and Budapest, Hungary Offline	Good point that Keith makes. The red flag would be someone hypoing how awesome the work is on the dog when the dogs was trialed at home in a "safe" environment. Sue DiCero http://www.k9imports.com
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ann freier wrote 05/03/2006 07:47 PM Re: Confirming Schutzhund titles [Re: Will Rambeau ] #105397 - 05/03/2006 07:47 PM
ann freier Webboard User Reg: 11-20-2005 Posts: 673 Loc: NE Nebraska Offline	i think that's probably smart will, but it makes me sad, as a newcomer to SCH/dogsports. i guess i'm old enough to know better, esp when the politics in 4H (!!) are so rampant--why wouldn't it be as bad/worse when it's grown-ups vs grown-ups? still disappoints me though... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />
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