Greetings,

I've noticed that in France, Germany, Austria, and most of Europe that there appears to be more of an emphasis on using dogs in tactical situations along side units like Germany's GSG-9 as oppossed to US SWAT teams. By that I mean that the US seems to use dogs in more of a passive manner for searching and detection work than taking down armed suspects.

Is there a reason for the different emphasis in the deployment and training between the law enforcement agencies in Europe and those in the United States in terms of police dogs?

I have asked Kevin Sheldahl to post on this thread. He is certainly one of the top Swat Dog instructors in the United States.

Boy,
I notice two of the posters on this are lawyers as they list their occupation. So, maybe I should just not answer <img src="http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
First, there are a variety of reasons that the dogs are used somewhat differently. But, at the same time it is not that done as differently as one might think.
Tazer shows a US swat team using a dog to allow them close enough with a Tazer to use it, I think it is on their web site (in fact it is from my city).
The difference in the use of the dogs reflects the difference in the use of tactical teams. The teams work in somewhat different fashions. I suspect due to differences in both law and custom.
I am not going to get into details on a public forum. Not that it is super secret but really it would be innapropriate to do so.

Yeah,

So, the United States can produce Police dogs of the same caliber as the ones we see in European countries? I'm just wondering if our guys are thinking too far inside the box and not enough outside it when it comes to police dogs. I know that the GSG-9 has dominated a lot of international SWAT competitions and I'm just wondering if they are ahead of the game in some respects.

Here is a video I found of a French Swat Team training dogs and I have to say I haven't seen anything like this in the United States.

http://www.sparta.cn/dl.php?fn=policedog.wmv&watch=1

ED'S COMMENTS EDITED INTO THIS POST:

This video has been around forever. This is nothing new and in my opinion should not be classified some kind of advanced training.

Jim,

I think you know that the United States does not produce Police dogs of the same caliber as the ones in Europe otherwise why would so many police dept.'s be buying imported pre-trained dogs. It is not a matter of thinking in or outside the paradigm but involves controlled breeding practices requiring working titles before breeding.

The use of dogs in tactical situations may be more passive here than in Europe because of laws and law suits restricting their use. Since you are a lawyer maybe you could post those differences to illustrate the restrictions or lack of. If the US is limited in its use of force with K9's as compared to GSG-9 then why would we being training for something never use except in competition; not cost effective or practical. I think most US K9 handler's train for what is needed and used on the street; they do not have the luxury of training primarily for competition.

Well said Alan! As a civilian I do not feel qualified to comment on this thread. However, what you have said is exactly what I was thinking. It is ashame that our k9 officers in the USA cannot be used to their full potential due to the threat of a lawsuit being filed against people who are working to uphold the law! One of those things that makes no sense.

Regards,
Debbie

Our laws may well be different from those in other countries, where civil rights are not given the same protections that we enjoy here. The lawsuits are based upon our laws. I am sure there are abuses of these lawsuits, but there may also be abuses by some poorly trained or simply lousy police. I am not criticizing the police at all, I am very supportive and respectful, but there are bad apples, and the laws are important to protect our civil liberties, which benefit our country as a whole. It is similar to the situation with medical malpractice. With it, there are many frivolous lawsuits, but without it, there is no way to get rid of bad or dangerous doctors, because the profession does not police itself well enough. Even in law, lawyers get sued for mispractice as well, although not for low ethics, unfortunately.

Criminals have it made in this country. Imagine 3 squares a day-must meet minimum caloric requirements, exercise, recreation..its a joke. Recidivism is very high.
These(US) dogs dont get enough bitework IMO and the cops have their hands tied. Toughest job in the world, damned if you do, damned if you dont. Proactive policing is called profiling, rascist and overly aggressive, excessive force etc, not enough and youre labeled inept and the crime rate is their fault. This country is a mess. Thank you ACLU and the judicial system. Bunch of rats.
I like how the dogs escort criminals in Holland-both in the car and street, wrong move and meet officer K-9s shiny teeth. Teach them a few manners. A true bark and hold.

I grew up around police officers, attorneys, and judges and believe me I know that among all three you have your good, bad, and ugly.

A lawsuit can be filed for almost anything under the tort of negligence. I know all about the types of laws used in private party v. private party lawsuits when it comes to dog bits as I'm studying for the bar exam and that has been a bar exam essay question several times. However, there are different stadards applied to law enforcement than to civilians as many things they do are protected as a priviledge.

I'm not an attorney yet, just a lawyer as I haven't passed my Bar Exam or Character and Fitness Board Review. I think we covered dog bites all of about one day in my three years of law school. So, while I can find out through researching what is the majority stance on use of police dogs I was more interested in the training aspect.

Are we (US) just not even trying to train dogs to that caliber or is it something that we just haven't perfected to the level the Europeans have? Do our larger police departments send handlers to Europe to train and learn?