Hi all,

Over the last 5 weeks I've watched Ed's main puppy DVDs, read through most of his articles, and searched the forum extensively.

Each time I had a question or problem, I found the answers.

However, right now I need some reassurance.

I read the BARF books and raw feeding articles, and today I started the new way of feeding.

My puppy is a 10 week old, female Shiba. She has been on Hill's Science Diet (kibbles until today.

This morning I gave her 1 chicken wing. She started out quite quickly, so I held it for her and she then started chewing hard while ripping of small chunks.

This may read strange, but there was something quite special about seeing her put those back legs back, arch her body and rip into the raw meat. Very satisfying to watch, it took her about 10 minutes to finish (compared to about 30 seconds with her kibble), so I felt good.

I then burned-out the engine in my blender, because I though it would be more than capable of handling chicken wings.

I did manage to put together a nice blend of veggies, some fruit, garlic and other stuff. I fed this to her at dinner and it went down quickly.

So, there seems to be no problem with the switch.

The reassurance needed is this: My co-worker reacted in horror when I told her about the chicken wing, and told me that her aunt's puppy had died due to a rupture in the stomach (or intestine) after eating a raw chicken wing.

Is this possible? If so, is it better to grind the wing and feed her larger meaty bones for her teeth and exercise, or should I get a kitchen ax and chop it into pieces?

Or, can I continue with the chicken wings?

I read other discussion on chicken wings, but I will sleep better with some feedback on this.

Thanks,
SSW

It is my understanding that raw meat and bones are fine, but cooked bones will splinter and can cause damage. I'm not a raw expert by any means, but this subject comes up often when people are wondering about the raw diet.

Sleep easy!

A whole chicken wing will not hurt your pup, but you will hear every horror story there is when you mention raw feeding to uninformed people. Only YOU have to be comfortable feeding your puppy - you don't have to worry about making anyone else comfortable.

A lot of people do grind up bones, but I think most of them grind up weight-bearing bones like the legs and thighs. If you are worried about the wings for such a young pup, try some chicken necks or backs, cut what you can with a knife, and let her have them. Be sure to sit with her until both she and you get used to the new food. Find out if she is a nibbler, a chewer, or a gulper. This will tell you how to serve your bones.

Also, on a different note - I noticed you fed her garlic. I would avoid this because garlic is in the onion family, and dogs do not do well on either one. If I remember correctly, they can build up toxins from onions and garlic.

Welcome to the world of raw feeding! You and your pup will never be sorry -- or happier!

Onions are more toxic than garlic, but the "safe" amount of garlic has yet to be determined. I avoid both.

My GSD pup (now 11 months) has been eating chicken necks as the staple of his diet since I got him at 3 months. No problems. I also have a 9 lb cat that eats chicken necks. I used to grind them for him, but he got impatient one day so I just threw a whole neck at him, and he managed just fine. He's built up some darn strong jaws and very clean teeth in the last year and a half. He can crunch through a whole chicken neck in less time than it takes my other wont-eat-anything-but-kibble cat to go through 1/3 cup of dried crap.

Cheers!

I asked the same question when my pup was 10 weeks old. Here's the url for the thread, it gave me peace of mind: http://www.leerburg.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Board=33&Number=112478&Searchpage=1&Main=12426&Words=chicken+Sandy+Moore&topic=0&Search=true#Post112478

I've been feeding chicken wings and chicken necks and turkey necks since then, whereas before he was eating raw meat with the bones ground in (Omaspride raw dog food, which he still eats). He's had no problem at any time. He is 5 months old now and does tend to swallow chicken necks whole, spends a little longer on chicken wings, and a relatively long time on large whole turkey necks. I would rather he didn't chew chicken wings 5-10 times then swallow them, but he hasn't had any problems. I usually try to give only 2 chicken wings at a time, so he doesn't have too many unchewed bones in his tummy. The chicken neck bones are small and though he swallows them whole, the bones are completely digested. It's pretty amazing how their digestive systems break down these raw bones (the non-weight bearing bones).

raw chicken wings are fine for a puppy. my pup's breeder weans all her litters on chicken wings. don't grind the bones. the pup gets a lot of satisfaction from doing it himself, it's good for developing strong jaws and neck muscles.

ditto on the garlic. if you want the dog to have the benefits of garlic, you might give one small garlic oil capsule in the veggie meal once or twice a month, but otherwise, avoid everything in the onion family. it is toxic to dogs.

Thanks for the replies, they are what I expected, but it is comforting to read it again.

About the garlic, I used this because it is listed in the BARF book as well as the 'Eat, Drink, and Wag Your Tail' DVD.

It is now 8 AM and I will go out to replace my blender, look for a grinder, and make some more patties.

I was quite concerned about the posts on this forum regarding the use of Garlic.

As I mentioned in my previous post, garlic is listed in the 4 dog nutrition books/DVD I bought from leerburg.

Since then I spoke to the Leerburg office staff, who assured me that they give their dogs garlic, so "...if it is toxic then their dogs would long be dead"

I also spoke with a nutritionist with the B.A.R.F company, who also assured me this is not a problem.

If there are still strong opinions about the use of garlic for dogs I would appreciate a reference to where this info is coming from. I suggest that this may be useful to customers who are new to RAW feeding.

I also had a question about the percentage of Kelp and Alf Alfa that should be used when following the canine and feline patty recipe in the B.A.R.F book. The B.A.R.F nutritionist suggested about 1.5% for each ingredient.

I have also bought some KEFIR grains, both water and milk kefir. The nutritionist told me that they use milk kefir in their product.

I look forward to cultivating sufficient quantities of the kefir to use for both my pup's and my own breakfast.

In the meantime, my pup is loving her chicken wings, her stools are exactly as described, and her breath has definitely improved.

I am now a true B.A.R.F convert, and my next step is getting my 2 cats to make the switch. Tthis will be a lot more difficult, so I think I will just fast them for 1 or 2 days, and give them the option to either eat or not eat. I hope that they will choose to eat RAW.

I just started feeding raw myself, so I'm not an expert. I'm just relaying what I read. In The Barf Diet by Ian Billinghurst, he says that cats, especially fat cats can develop hepatic lipidosis(not even sure what it is, but its fatal) if fasted for long periods of time. (over 24 and at most 48 hours) Not a cat forum, but I wanted to relay what I had read. That book said that a slow switch is best for cats. We now return to your regular dog disscussion already in progress.

Thanks for pointing that out! I have the same book (and 3 others), but in the last month I have read and watched so much dog material that I am suffering from info overload. I will definitely make sure I follow Billinghurst's advice before making the switch.

Back to the dog...I just got a big bag of goat bones, and right now she is having a great time attacking her play bone (growling and tearing.