Hi all,

My 5-month-old male ACD pup has presented me with an interesting problem. I'm thinking he's either really weird or really smart. I was hoping for some input:

Riot is at the point he can be crated for a good 4 to 5 hours as long as he's ALONE. No accident. He can be crated in my vehicle, or in my bedroom as long as I'm not in the bedroom. He sleeps and then when I go to let him out he's dry, has a full bladder, and is generally without issue.

HOWEVER, at night when he's crated in my room and I'm there, he won't hold it for even a couple of hours. At 5 months old he should be sleeping through the general 8-hour night, but even if he wasn't he should only need out ONCE. But he'll wake up and start scratching at the crate door at least every 1 to 2 hours. When I first got him, I took him out figuring he'd have an accident if I did not. But now it's starting to get old and I'm getting VERY tired. LOL.

The thing is, if I DON'T take him out, he will pee or poop. Even though he doesn't have to go, because if I wasn't in the room he'd hold it. Then naturally I take him out (cursing, LOL) and clean his crate and I dunno... Am I just giving him what he wants?

It's like the dog learned that if I'm not around he has to hold it, but if I'm there he can scratch at the door and, failing that, mess in his crate to be freed. Damn dog is smarter than I am as he's trained me well! But what do I do now? Leave him in his mess until morning?

I suppose the easiest solution would be to crate him in a different room. But I really need him to be able to be crated near me as I sleep for travel purposes (i.e. in a hotel room) so avoiding the problem or "management" really isn't a long term solution. And advice?

Thanks in advance!

I'd still move him into a different room at night. You want him to learn how to sleep through the night in his crate, and right now he's not learning that. He's learning that if he makes enough racket, you'll come and get him.

Move him out, and set your alarm to take him out once in the night. And make it a no nonsense, no attention trip. Once he is sleeping through the night consistently for a few weeks, you could try him in your room again. Right now I think you are just creating a bigger problem for yourself by not moving him out - especially since you seem pretty sure that would solve the problem.

Good Luck!

You did not mention how much space he has when he is in his crate so at the risk of giving you uneccessary advice, I would limit the amount of space that he has. Give him just enough room to turn around. And I too would move him to another room. You are going to have to take a few steps backwards in your crate training before moving forward.
Good Luck
Terry

I followed Ed's advice for crate training and it worked very well with my 5 month old pup. The best part of that advice was moving him to another room (and in our case another building on our property!)

He raised absolute hell but he did learn that it wouldn't get him anywhere. Buy some ear plugs, turn on some very low soothing music for him, and be prepared to gut it out for a night...or several. It will pass!

I also found the "at night no nonsense" philosophy worked well too. No lights, no games, no stimulation other than a "Good outside" when I took him to pee.

Thanks for the responses so far! It's not a crate size issue because the crate in the car is the same size as the one in my room, and it's big enough for him to stand and turn in but no bigger. I'm going to try letting him sleep in the hallway tonight and see if that doesn't help. Maybe in a few weeks' time he'll have learned to hold it.

Jennifer ,
My sons king Charles did the same thing to him , we had him in the crate next to his bed and he would cry to get out when my son was in the room but would be quiet if he was gone.We covered the crate so he could not see my sons' ware about and it worked after a bit but eventually we moved him downstairs.My son could not sleep and wake up for school on time so we had to end the sleeping in his room deal.
I wish you luck, I know how much my son wanted his pup in his room but for now it's impossible.

I didn't see any mention of what time you stop giving him food and water before bed, so this may be redundant. But, just in case, stop all food and water about 3 hrs before bed time. Then take him out for his final pre-bed potty break just before you crate him.

Elaine,I don't know that your question is adressed to me but we stop at 5pm.For the King Charles only.

Update: Last night I stopped Riot's food and water at 8:00pm so that we could go to bed at 11:00pm... He slept crated in the hall just outside of my bedroom. He was quiet ALL NIGHT with no accidents, until at about 7:30am when I woke up on my own and took him outside. He was then great again until about 9:30am when my alarm goes off, then he barked and pawed even though he certainly didn't have to go (it had been just 2 hours since he was out at 7:30) so I waited until he stopped barking and pawing, then went out of my room.

Since I think he's started to associate the alarm with my mad dash to get him outside, I held off and did not take him outside again until I was ready for work. I want him to stop associating the alarm with going out. I want him to think going out relates to NOTHING but my decision to take him out and that way hopefully he won't get excited every time he hears the alarm.

Hopefully with practice we'll get better!

Thanks for all the responses. As far as stopping food/water, I try to be good about that but sometimes I'm too lax on the water. I know he won't die of thirst but he'll try and convince you otherwise. Sigh... He's got me wrapped around his cute little freckled dingo paw. But I'll be good about it from now on!

Angelique, no the question was for Jennifer.

Jennifer, Of course he's got you wrapped around his paw. Dogs are champion manipulators and herding breeds tend to be the best of the best at manuevering us. After all, that's what they were bred to do -- manuever things. (LOL)