I got a new pup, 6 months old Mal, he's great. but he needs some direction.
I'v got a prong collar, and will be getting a e-collar soon.

Is it to soon to use the e-collar and prong collar on a 6 month old dog?

I'm thinking it's ok, I just need to get more gentle with the corrections. Is this correct?

Any feedback would be great.

When did you get the pup? Wouldn't use a prong til he settles in and finds a place in your pack.....where did you get him? Bloodlines?

You know....the usual barrage of questions.......

I am pretty sure i dont need to say this but i will any way

I am not sure at what age you should get into heavy obedince work but you shouldent correct your dog untill he knows the task first. But on a 6 month old i dont think it would take much and i am sure he is still learning.

Then again there are a lot wiser trainers on here then me :-D

(sorry for the horrable spelling)

I'm glad to hear you haven't already just started using the prong or e-collar on him, as at 6 months, big or not I don't believe a puppy that age should have either used on them(JMO)

I see too many pet stores selling prong collars for 8 and 12 week old large breed puppies and the owners go along with it because they don't know any better. I have met some 4 and 5 month old puppies raised on a prong collar that pull and fight the prong collar, causing damage to themselves. The collars are ineffective for those dogs and causing harm but people still use them. Not saying you would of course, but using the "strongest"
method first (and too young) can desensitize an animal to correction. It happened with a few of the horses I bought and retrained and I've seen it in puppies as young as 6 months. Though I saw it primarily with APBT pups, a Rottie, an English Mastiff and a Cane Corso, I saw a few Labs, a poodle, and a GSD or two that were young and didn't react to corrections with a prong. I imagine it would be the same for a fair amount of dogs. These were all dogs I saw come into the pet store I used to work at, customers that had prong collars suggested to them by other employees at that very store when the dogs were only 3-4 months of age.

Proper use of the collars may not lead to these problems, but I didn't see any proper use with those dogs and my own dogs don't see a prong or e collar until 1 year of age. Personal preference

What kind of "direction" does the pup need? What kind of problems are you having? Primarily walking well on a lead, recall ... ? Specifying the issues will help us help you

 Quote: jennifer marshal

These were all dogs I saw come into the pet store I used to work at, customers that had prong collars suggested to them by other employees at that very store when the dogs were only 3-4 months of age.

Could what you saw as desentization really have more to do with the fact that they were improperly fit or used? As someone said on here recently (sorry, can't remember who...Mike Arnold? Was it you?) "An improperly fitted prong collar corrects a dog about as much as shaking a finger at it" or something similar.

I use prongs on puppies when their behavior warrants it; I don't go by age, necessarily. My one GSD didn't challenge me until he was over a year old. My other one bit me after a correction at 11ish weeks. His sire is highly handler-aggressive, so knowing the potential, yep, Baby got himself fitted for a prong! Depends on the dog is all I'm saying.

If he just got a 6 month old, the dog may settle in fine and not need it, but honestly, properly used, they're not torture devices, so why not use them? Why wait until you have a big problem?

thanks for the input,

the reason for the prong is not because of pulling, on lead he is really good actually. But since he is a Mal. he loves his prey, and to chase, a does not know the boudries yet. like streets, ... stuff like that, I thought a remote collar would help with off lead training in the city.

It's only been two year since I did the same training with my kelpie, I suppose I could do it again with just a normal collar, it worked the first time.

-ted

 Quote:

...he loves his prey, and to chase, a does not know the boudries yet.

I used a prong on my big, male Dobe at that age for the same reasons. I think it's okay if it's properly fitted, your expectations are realistic and the collar is not OVER used. I think it really depends on the dog. For me it was about just being able to manage all of that strength and prey-drive drive long enough to redirect it onto something positive. I didn't give any 'real' corrections until about eight months though, and I'm not sure how I feel about using an electric collar on a dog that young. Though I'll admit, my experience with electric collars is limited. My guy is still a pretty soft dog when it comes to corrections, still loves training and his drive is still alive and well and living in a bigger body.

Edited by Kristel Smart (08/04/2007 03:50 PM)
Edit reason: wanted to add something

 Quote: jenni williams

 Quote: jennifer marshal

These were all dogs I saw come into the pet store I used to work at, customers that had prong collars suggested to them by other employees at that very store when the dogs were only 3-4 months of age.

Could what you saw as desentization really have more to do with the fact that they were improperly fit or used? As someone said on here recently (sorry, can't remember who...Mike Arnold? Was it you?) "An improperly fitted prong collar corrects a dog about as much as shaking a finger at it" or something similar.

I use prongs on puppies when their behavior warrants it; I don't go by age, necessarily. My one GSD didn't challenge me until he was over a year old. My other one bit me after a correction at 11ish weeks. His sire is highly handler-aggressive, so knowing the potential, yep, Baby got himself fitted for a prong! Depends on the dog is all I'm saying.

If he just got a 6 month old, the dog may settle in fine and not need it, but honestly, properly used, they're not torture devices, so why not use them? Why wait until you have a big problem?

I agree it depends on the dog, and most of them were not fitted properly but a lot of those dogs had actual "wounds" places where the collar dug in or scrapes from it rubbing from the dog pulling as hard as it could. I tested a prong on myself, on my thigh. More towards the butt, there is more "padding" such as the base of the dogs neck, and behind the knee being similar to the correct possition of behind the ears/jawline. There is a definitne difference but you pull hard enough it still HURTS no matter where you put it. Dogs can become desensitized to pain or the feeling of a correction even when a collar is not fitted properly. Placing the collar in the correct place will be sharper, but dogs that are used to the feeling can easily ignore it unless you use a good amount of force, which most people won't or can't do.

I agree with the use of prong collars, I use them I am not boycotting the use of them but have always had success with younger dogs (under 9 months) being trained in either flat nylon collars or choke chains, but I ALWAYS keep my pups on a long lead (30') and make a point to present them with situations I expect them to be tempted by so that I can address issues 100% prepared.

I just prefer to work my way up the ladder when it comes to corrections rather than jumping to the top and having nowhere to go from there

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