Hi all,

Am new in BARF, but i find the article (link below) doesn't publish the truth and a bit narrow minded for the comparison.

http://www.mybluedog.com/rawmeat_crane.html

Pls advice.

I find this article very suspicious. It seams like a total condemnation to all the barfers out there.

The facts seams a bit twisted like for instance the author mentioned of lifespan of wolfs in the wild compared to those in captivity and go on th justify the only reason for this diff in commercial food. What about the rule of "survival of the fittest?" Rank Challenge, Predator Threat, wounds, lact of vetcare and more which obviously contruibuted to lifespan factor.

Also the theory of bones wrapped nicely in furs passed out as a feces. This is really intriguing, my dogs had been on BARF for years and I had never had an chance to see any whole bones in the feces even when I gave the dogs a whole beef knuckle to chew on. I really wonder if there is any opportunity of all for such thing as the bones come out whole being wrapped by furs.

Hope some experts on BARF here can say something. Anyone knows who the joker is? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />

 Quote:

Originally posted by James Cruiser:
Also the theory of bones wrapped nicely in furs passed out as a feces....I really wonder if there is any opportunity of all for such thing as the bones come out whole being wrapped by furs.

Didn't read the referenced article, but can tell you that wolf biologist L. David Mech's book "The Wolf" says exactly that - sharp pieces of bone are excreted neatly wrapped in a wad of the prey animal's fur. It's obviously nature's way of protecting the predator.

I count 30+ references to peer reviewed articles and books. Can anybody provide a single reference to a study done on Dr. Billinghurst's work, or any of the other raw/homemade diets? Just one would do. I have researched it extensively and have never found any. I also read Dr. Billinghurst's response to the article, not a single bit of evidence provided. I would assume Dr. Billinhurst would be familiar with the process and would be capable of doing such a study. There hasn't even been a study published that demonstrates that dogs on his diet are in fact recieving adequate nutrition from it. Not one. Dr. Billinghurst is conducting a study to support his diet. It is based soley on anecdotal information from people that use his diet. Any chance that might be a little bit biased? Is it interesting that Dr. Billinghurst is now producing a commercial diet?

I have tried a few times to convert my dogs to this type of diet, with no success. I did it based on the recomendations of people I know and the reports from books on the subject. Then I started to read and look for evidence that it was a sound diet. I did all this backwards. It didn't work for me. A friend of mine fed her dog raw from day one and the breeder fed raw before the dog came to her. The dog had to be taken off the diet before he died of ulcerative colitis. She almost lost the dog 3 times to bacterial infections from his food and continued to feed the raw diet. The dog also suffers from dysplasia in both elbows and hips. All of which are supposed to be prevented by the raw diet. She just got a new puppy and feeds it a commercial diet. Not everyone gets good results from a raw diet.

If you have good luck with the diet and that is what you want to feed, great. Just understand that there is nothing but limited anectodtal evidence from biased sources to support feeding it. Not even the gurus of raw feeding can cite a single bit of evidence to support that the diet is any way better, it is all based on their opinion and for every one of them that support it there are 5 that don't.

Originally posted by Richard Cannon:
I also read Dr. Billinghurst's response to the article, not a single bit of evidence provided.
Richard, Thanks for the comments. Can you share with us where about can I find the article on Billinghurst's response to that article?

Anyone else wanted to share some thoughts here? I tot that if Ed is having so much confidence in BARF definately he must have seen something that others doesnt.

Thanks.....anyone.

Sure James.

Here is the link to Dr. Billinhurst's Reply . In effect it is just a restatement of his position. One thing I noticed about it is that there is no documentation to back up a single statement he makes.

As he states many people have had success with the various raw and homemade diets. The problem I have is the idea that there are no problems with using it. Much of the information put forward isn't accurate. I would have fewer problems with the statements made about the diet if there were more realistic statements about the real risks involved. These diets are based on faith and the suppositions of authors with no back up from any type of objective data. Much of what is said just doesn't fit with what is know about parasitism and bacteriology.

If it works for you great. It didn't work for me. It hasn't worked for others I know. I have had good luck with feeding comercial food. I ahve had 2 dogs live to over 20 years on commercial foods. The rest of my dogs tend to live 50% or more beyond the average life span for the breed. I think that as much of the results that I have seen, and others have seen on some of these other diets, is based more on exellent care and proper medical treatment for these dogs (and cats) than to their diet. Feed the dogs adequate amounts of food, get them proper medical care, make sure that they aren't overly abused by life and you will see the same results.

I have always fed my dogs and cats premium kibble and can food. However, my senior dog and my 5 yr. old dog are fat. I've always fed them light or senior formulas and don't feed them table scraps. My husband however, enjoys giving them too many "biscuits" at night while watching TV. My senior dog is 14 and in excellent health with the exception of being overweight. I'd like to see him live to 20 so I want him to lose the fat!! I'm afraid of putting him on stictly a raw diet at this stage of his life. Can someone give me some advice on what to feed him to help him lose weight. He's a small mixed breed. He weighs 28 lbs. and should weigh around 20. I was thinking of cutting back on the packaged food and supplmenting his feedings with lean raw meat. What do you think?

Less food + exercise = weight loss

Doesn't matter what you feed.

What I would do though is maximize the quality of the food and limit intake.

i.e. Don't feed that senior dog crap, switch to a high quality human grade kibble and just keep the amounts fed low. (if you don't want to do raw)

That way you are getting more benefit out of the calories that you do feed.

I hate to tell you this but------Vancamp is right----- second, I,ll do my own testing. Out of six pups I kept the largest and the runt. I am the only one feeding Raw. But not all raw. I free feed Royal Canine during the day, during which they will eat MAYBE 2 cups. Then in the afternoon I will give each 1 1/2 lb of green tripe. These are the biggest healthiest most energetic twelve week olds I or my Vet. has ever seen. Just dont let them lick you!--------There breath will knock you over! just kidding.
Kibble has been around a long time. Long enough for venders to make a lot of money and pay for the right out come of a lot of surveys.

Raw on the other hand has not been commercialized
that long. The more popular it gets the more the kibble people will find ways to attack it.
Ron

Hi Richard,

yeah i can understand your view, but......solely from my personal experience, once i switched my dogs to raw....i can see the different in them.

I do feed them commercial dog food once or twice a week or when my raw ingredient are out of supply.