Rhodesian Ridgeback for schutzhund work?
#177554 - 01/26/2008 07:06 PM |
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I'm researching breeders/bloodlines trying to find my next ridgeback. I really would like to do schutzhund with my next ridge. I really like the sport but think my rescue shepherd can only go so far, he does not have temperment to handle the protection or the elbows to do the A frame so we'll just do obedience. I know it is typically a working dog sport but I REALLY REALLY NEED a ridgeback at all times. Mine is 13 years old and I hate even considering looking into breeders when I know he's going to live another 5 years at least (I pray!). I know a lot of people frown on the idea. All my shepherd friends don't understand why I could possibly want something other than a gsd or mali. I'm just looking for some encouragement that yes a ridgeback has been sucessful. Either way I'm getting another and if he turns into a couch potato who demands to have his head on a pillow and a blanket over him when he's cold just like my boy so be it but I'm still going to try!
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Re: Rhodesian Ridgeback for schutzhund work?
[Re: Kathleen Heth ]
#177558 - 01/26/2008 07:16 PM |
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I don't know any ridgebacks in schutzhund. It will be very hard to find a good working ridgeback because there are more showline ridges.
"It's better to be an optimist who is sometimes wrong than a pessimist who is always right" |
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Re: Rhodesian Ridgeback for schutzhund work?
[Re: Kathleen Heth ]
#177559 - 01/26/2008 07:19 PM |
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The fact that they are a sighthound makes me doubt they will track.
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Re: Rhodesian Ridgeback for schutzhund work?
[Re: steve strom ]
#177560 - 01/26/2008 07:21 PM |
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The fact that they are a sighthound makes me doubt they will track.
I disagree because sighthounds can track. You can google it up on youtube. There are sighthounds that chase hares. Type in hunting galgo.
Ridgebacks are known to hung lions, elephants, and leopards with poachers; therefore, they should be able to track those animals.
"It's better to be an optimist who is sometimes wrong than a pessimist who is always right" |
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Re: Rhodesian Ridgeback for schutzhund work?
[Re: Lindsay Janes ]
#177564 - 01/26/2008 07:37 PM |
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I'm pretty confident they will track. Actually ridgebacks hunt by sight and scent. I know they got thrown in the sighthound category but most I've met follow their noses (usually to food). I know mine can smell out a possum a mile away.
I'm mostly worried about the obedience part, very independent.
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Re: Rhodesian Ridgeback for schutzhund work?
[Re: Kathleen Heth ]
#177570 - 01/26/2008 08:01 PM |
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Found this on ridgeback site. Actually found similar on another site, other site said stay away from sch work because they are too sensitive to correction. When Dante was younger we used to play attack all the time. I could lift my arm above my head and he's jump up and grab it. I could not pull loose his grip was so soft and only increased with my pulling. Of course ours was all play and if I said leave it he'd stop. He's got no aggression issues. I agree with them being sensitive to correction, they don't forgive and forget.
NEVER encourage your Ridgeback to be aggressive or defensive. When your Ridgeback is mature, it will know when that type of behavior will be appropriate. To encourage a Ridgeback to be a TOUGH dog, CAN create a dog that will have to be put to death for aggression. This breed DOES NOT work as guard or protection dogs for a reason, they are NOT reliable for the release command in order to have true control over the dog. Ridgebacks do not do Schutzhund work (personal protection) because they are not reliable like German Shepherd Dogs, Dobermans and Rotties.
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Re: Rhodesian Ridgeback for schutzhund work?
[Re: Kathleen Heth ]
#177576 - 01/26/2008 09:37 PM |
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OK… Call me crazy, but all of that sounds more like a training issue, and not a “breed” issue. (Some trainers never give a correction in training, PM Bob Scott and ask about his success) And there are soft and hard examples of GSDs, Rotts and Mals too. This is a temperament thing and not a breed thing and both types can do SCH.
NEVER encourage your Ridgeback to be aggressive or defensive. When your Ridgeback is mature, it will know when that type of behavior will be appropriate. To encourage a Ridgeback to be a TOUGH dog, CAN create a dog that will have to be put to death for aggression.
I have heard this phrase used to describe just about all breeds by anti-bite work (ehm… uneducated) people.
When I mention Schutzhund to most people the first thing they say is, “Why would you want him to bite. It will only make him more aggressive.” A lot of breeders of our working dogs are against any sort of bite work and love to place an emphasis on traits that they feel are more important or that make their breed superior. This gives you the (mostly show line) Rotts that act like labs, and the shepherds that are afraid of their shadows. Working line people love to brag in the opposite direction; about how dominant or prey driven their dogs are and why their breed or dog is the best. Some of this is propaganda, some is politics, some is ego.
Bottom line is, there are many breeders out there that focus on what the breed is supposed to be, and when you find one, talk to the breeder about your goals and desires. If they shut you down, talk to another. Just don’t be looking at the “I have two RRs and a litter of pups” or the show breeders. Do a lot of research. Test the pups for the confidence and prey drive. Find the pup that is what you want.
The fact that there are not many RRs, if any, that compete tells you that you probably won’t find a pup that will excel, but you don’t have to excel. I have seen mutts and labs out there training and having a great time. It is a sport that helps you bond with your dog and have a lot of fun. If you want a RR that will primarily be your pet, get one and see what he (or she) can do. Who knows, you might end up with a star! If you want to compete with the best, get a breed that is bred to do it.
Good luck finding your next baby!
Jessica
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Re: Rhodesian Ridgeback for schutzhund work?
[Re: JessicaKromer ]
#177581 - 01/26/2008 11:31 PM |
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Thanks Jessica and all. Yeah I guess those articles are written by people who've never been around a schutzhund dog.
Those are my thoughts exactly on the suggestion to never do protection work with a ridgeback. I don't see how if it's done right it can ruin a dog. Doing my research online RR are used as police dogs, track, even herd ... still haven't found a schutzhund! They are considered gun dogs, scenthounds, and sighthounds depending on the registry. They were originally bred to be all purpose hunting and family protection and it appears they have had difficulty grouping them because they fit into different groups.
I'm not expecting a dog who will go to national levels or anything. Haha even if I purchased a working pup from top schutzhund lines I'm sure I wouldn't do that at my level.
I mainly enjoy the challenge of the sport and the bonding with my dog.
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Re: Rhodesian Ridgeback for schutzhund work?
[Re: JessicaKromer ]
#177582 - 01/26/2008 11:31 PM |
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I knew a Ridgeback a guy tried to start in schutzhund. The dog just didn't have the desire to do the work. He would chase the sack a little, but just didn't have the "want" and would make a couple of half-hearted chases, then pretty much quit after a few minutes. The guy eventually got a GSD for schutzhund. I'm sure you could find a ridgeback that you could do schutzhund with, but you will really have to look hard at pedigrees and breeders plus you will need to find someone who will know how to work the dog to bring out sufficient prey drives, etc..
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Re: Rhodesian Ridgeback for schutzhund work?
[Re: susan tuck ]
#177598 - 01/27/2008 10:14 AM |
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When I first got my Ridgeback I also flirted with the idea of protection training. After talking to lots of people and researching, I decided it was not a good idea. Here is a story that was related to me that helped me to change my mind:
I decided that I had reason to put a four year old bitch through attack training for farm use. (Please note, again, we repeat that attack training is not regarded as a good option for our RR's; in fact we recommend strongly against it.) It was extremely difficult to get her to bite when we reached that part of the course, and for the first time she lagged behind the others.
It is worth pointing out at this stage that the dogs participating together were a GSD, a Rottweiler, a Doberman, a Bull-terrier, a Staffie, and of course the Rhodesian Ridgeback . Probably this assortment represents trouble to a trainer spelt in capital block letters. The two terriers were a washout, the first three mentioned trundled along at very much the identical rate of progress, but the RR surged way ahead while we were tackling obedience as an essential prerequisite to the more aggressive discipline to follow. Most fortunately the trainer moved onto the next skill as soon as the previous one had been mastered by any one of them; and that one was always the RR. She left them all floundering behind her and obviously revelled in these novel experiences. So she and I omitted two sessions of the course to let some of the others catch up, did the final "revision" session, and went pell-mell into the attack phase.
As already stated she just refused to bite. So her ears were given a couple of good jerks and, after the second "prompting", she ran around behind me, launched into his proffered arm, and started removing all the padding. Stopping her was something she had yet to learn about, so she did another circuit behind me and launched into him for the second time. Fortunately his reactions were quick; he thumped his partly protected arm down on her head while she made for his ankle. She backed off, ran around behind me again, and launched herself at his throat. Once more his quick reactions saved the day, while he fended her off with his ripped up protected arm. I brought her under control, we mutually agreed that her attack methods necessitated no further embellishment, and her attack-training days were over.
On reflection it all made sense. Why on earth did she have to bite that fellow? Sure, he was pointing at her, staring, making stupid noises, acting very silly, but where was the threat? And then he jerked her ears. Certainly the first time was uncomfortable, but for heaven's sake he did it again. Then he gets that clumsy arm in the way and she gets a mouthful of evil tasting canvas, hessian, and grass stuck between her teeth which she cannot spit out easily, so the obvious thing to do is to go for a softer, tastier target.
It is amazing how much damage she wreaked in so short a time. He had lost the outer covering on his arm-shield and was down to the leather, and he didn't fancy that overly much for protection in the circumstances. Also there was nothing for the other dogs to hang onto, so "taking a bite" was out for the day in any event.
It all went to prove why attack work is not to be recommended. Ridgies have very powerful jaws. They lunge in, take a big bite, use their potent necks to twist that very strong head, and then jerk back violently, taking fresh bites whenever the current mouthful yields.
Three other owners described almost identical experiences after participation in attack courses with their Ridgies.
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