christina's thread about her 14 mo old doberman showing aggression to strangers petting got me wondering (sorry, this is probably coming out of nowhere).

teagan displays similar behaviour. she reacts very poorly to people who unwittingly place themselves in a dominant position when approaching her, and in general is far less tolerant of strangers - if she decides she wants to be petted, that's one thing, but uninvited petting she's done poorly with, though i have taught her she can't bare her teeth at people etc - she's a lot more polite though i have seen her scare people by glaring at them (they sorta stop in their tracks and decide they'd rather pet luc instead).

but i'm curious about the whole stranger thing. can dogs sense when people are related? do we share similar scents as a result of having similar DNA?
(i told you this would be a weird question!)

i wonder b/c not only did luc do better w/my mom and brother immediately when he was still adjusting, but teagan was immediately tolerant of them petting and handling her (other than one blip when my brother didn't allow her into the car, but that's a different scenario). now of course i'd like to think my family is smarter and approach her better, and that may be part of it, but in general teagan has very noticeably treated them differently, and allowed liberties w/them she would not allow with someone else.

i guess it could also be i'm very comfortable w/my family, and the dogs pick up on that, but i'm including friends of mine whom i'm very comfortable w/in the 'stranger' category.

i did some searching but didn't find anything.

sorry if this is a really stupid question

Not at all stupid, Jennifer. I've wondered the same thing.

My mom visited in December and that was the first time she met True. He LOVED her...constantly sat next to her and gave her the mushy "look" he usually reserves for me. And this wasn't a particularly stress-free, laid-back visit, which made it all the more surprising.

We actually wondered if it was due to the strong physical resemblance between my mom and me.

I think that's a very legitamate question! Seems like it could be likley, maybe not in a lot of dogs though. Like the dogs who can smell out cancer or detect a seizure before it happens.

My bet would be that dogs cannot sense a relative through scent. They CAN however sense the energy that YOU as the handler give off in the other person's presence.

yeah, both of them have taken to my family quickly.

and in the incident over the christmas break ( http://www.leerburg.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Board=134&Number=171284&Searchpage=6&Main=17554&Words=aggressive+luc&topic=0&Search=true#Post171284 ) (by the way, i have since found out that the male was not a PSD washout, but a retired PSD dog, and the female was a washout that the guy needs to 'have it out with' every few weeks. idiot)

but teagan broke her prong that night. and b/c i'm dumb and we were out in the country, i hadn't bothered with her backup collar. i actually think she probably broke the prong when i still had her and she was plunging to get at the other dogs, and then i pulled her away and ran to look for luc, then i gave her to my mom while i kept looking, but she's a longcoat and the prong often gets caught in her fur. but she was amped up that night - when my mom and that guy found luc under a trailer, was when my mom noticed the prong was broken. my mom put her arms around teagan to restrain her, and teagan allowed it without any sort of hestiation, aggression towards my mom, or any issues. and teagan was growling at luc (she tends not to not like luc acting oddly), and once i got there and told my mom to put the lead on her agitation collar (i always leave it on, not cause we do agitation, but i find a handle useful w/teagan....now that we've established she isn't allowed to come up the collar), teagan immediately tried to get the guy whose dogs had attacked us. so she was amped up and aggressive, but very calm with my mom. and she'd only known my mom for a few days.

i honestly was shocked that she tolerated my mom doing that. and even before hand, she'd been great w/my mom and brother and being petted (she sought it out in a way she has never done with other strangers), handled (other than the car incident) in a way she does not tolerate w/other strangers. it got me thinking anyways....glad i'm not the only one who wonders

yeah john....i'm not even sure if we smell the same as relatives on any level. google withheld that mystery from me

This is an interesting question. I hope someone knows the answer, it is not a dumb question.

This is interesting. We have actually discussed this at length in many search practices. Family members can smell very similar due to the eating the same food, washing their clothes together with the same detergent, using the same bath soap, body chemistry can be similar, etc. Because of this (and other reasons) we do not encourage family members to go along with us when we do searches. While each person has their own scent, there still may be similarities. We have done several trails with identical twins and the dogs where able to tell the difference and follow the one they were cued on (scent pad). The dog's sense of smell just amazes me every time.

Sandy

that is interesting! huh.

well, my mom and brother live together, but we'd been together for a few days at the point of the bad night. but presumably we do have similar body chemistry, perhaps combined w/behaviour....hmmm.

i know on the cabin weekend two weekends ago, i drove up w/my cabinmate friday morning and teagan at no point during the weekend recognized her as someone who achieved a level similar to me - my mom and brother could give commands to teagan and she'd obey (stuff like sit, both during meals/food prep and while relaxing) but teagan had zero respect for my cabinmate - she liked her, but walked all over her and didn't listen to her at all, and displayed rude and dominant pack behaviour to her. (i had to step in constantly)

i'm going to watch this and see how she is with different personalities - but i'd say she's met at least 15 friends at this point and never treated them the way she treated family. luc was settled b/f i started bringing him out with people and he's such a happy goof who loves anyone (well, mostly....he has been alert/aggressive when i was injured, weirdly) it's hard to compare but he met my family the second day i had him on a hike and took to them immediately, and was comfortable being left with them (call of nature and such things).

Hepper PG (1986). Sibling recognition in the domestic dog. Anim Behav, 34:288-289
Basically it says that dogs were unable to discrimanate between identical twins only if they were fed the same diet and had the same environmental factors.
They have no problem discriminating between other family members. Nothing that I've read comments on the ability to match family members.