hey all. i know you guys prob/ see this post or something like it all the time and i apologize, but i know every breeder strives for different things in their breeding program and there are certain things im looking for in my future addition to my house hold.
first off a little background about me. I have trained hunting retrievers for field trials for about 5 years and loved every minute of it.but about a year ago i got the opportunity to become a law enforcement officer for our local community. when doing so, I lost most of my day time which made it hard to stick to a well rounded retriever training program (its hard to watch a dog bumber fly in the air 200 yards away in the dark :grini didnt think it was fair to the dog to only train maybe two days a week so i got out of it..
anyways while on the job I started watching the two k9 units we have on our force work during training and while out on the streets and really enjoyed it . after watching them, reading books,websites and watching "umpteen" hours of leerburgs training videos I know this is the new type of training I would like to do and am now looking for the right gsd pup for the job.
i will be training this dog for advanced obendiece and schutzhund, as well as a house hold protector while my wife is asleep and im at work.
i know looks arent extremly important to alot of breeders but me and my other half are really partial to short coated gsd's with alot of black and a little silver(not light tan) or alot of black little dark-tan on them.
what im looking for in the pups personality.
I want a pup with allot of prey drive and self confidence, I want one that doesn't startle very easy and if startled can recover quickly. one that if put in a new environment it takes it in stride and doesn't freak out.one that is not real independent but also doesn't need me to hold her hand through every situation.I want a pup that is not real pain sensitive. also it has to have a good bite. the pup must not try and bite if you or I try and take a toy away from it(this is a big must because I want to stay away from a handler aggressive dog as much as possible. also i dont need a huge gsd. and prefer a female(the reason is in most every other dog i have trained the female were easier and smaller)

any info is welcomed extremely appreciated.

thanks Jeff S.

You'd probably be better off getting a green dog that you can get someone to test for you and make sure it's the dog you're looking for. You'll see it written here over and over, puppies are a crapshoot because it's true.

It's so easy to screw a good puppy up too! Get a puppy that you think has a problem that's going to take a long time to fix, then go to a Micheal Ellis seminar and in under 5 minutes both "problems" are fixed! The dog doesn't have a problem, it's a trainer/handler problem LOL

very true, puppies are a "crap shoot", in any breed you go to and any sport your into, but im willing to take that risk. i have bought young dogs before and i just never seemed to get the bond like i was able to with a puppy. i guess what im looking for if a proven cross that has both parents like what im looking for in a puppy.

It seems from your post that you're asking for an exceptional puppy with perfect temperament, that's hard to find. The dog in my byline was middle aged when i got him, the bond was no different than with a puppy. I want a replacement for him but can't find the "same" dog, go figure right? They're all so different.

I kind of don't understand what you mean by "I want a pup that is not real pain sensitive"? A high drive dog that can work brings with it some behaviours that training takes care of, having such high expectations out of any single puppy can lead to disappointment.

The K9's you've seen were most likley selected and tested as green dogs, not bought as puppies. Just a few thoughts to ponder,

 Quote: Jeffrey Smith

also it has to have a good bite. the pup must not try and bite if you or I try and take a toy away from it(this is a big must because I want to stay away from a handler aggressive dog as much as possible.

This has to be taught & as a novice with these dogs, be careful teaching it. You can take a perfectly good puppy, and turn it into a dog that won't bite anything b/c you whacked it over the head too many times for biting. A high drive, well-bred working GSD pup will be mouthing and biting you for what seems like an eternity. If you want a 'good bite'/biting adult dog, there is a certain amount of this you're going to have to take, it part of the territory in raising these dogs. These aren't retrievers breed for a soft mouth . Also, this behavior in pups has little to nothing to do with handler aggression. Just make sure when you take food/toys away from a pup, do it fairly 7 demonstrate to the pup that it'll have the opportuniy to get them back.

 Quote: Jeffrey Smith

also it has to have a good bite. the pup must not try and bite if you or I try and take a toy away from it(this is a big must because I want to stay away from a handler aggressive dog as much as possible.

This has to be taught & as a novice with these dogs, be careful teaching it. You can take a perfectly good puppy, and turn it into a dog that won't bite anything b/c you whacked it over the head too many times for biting. A high drive, well-bred working GSD pup will be mouthing and biting you for what seems like an eternity. If you want a 'good bite'/biting adult dog, there is a certain amount of this you're going to have to take, it part of the territory in raising these dogs. These aren't retrievers breed for a soft mouth . Also, this behavior in pups has little to nothing to do with handler aggression. Just make sure when you take food/toys away from a pup, do it fairly 7 demonstrate to the pup that it'll have the opportuniy to get them back.

Does the department run patrol dogs (bite work)? What do they and their insurance say about it?

Are you wanting to train for bite work?

If not, there is no reason that you could not take one of the high drive lab pups and train for narcotics and maybe even tracking.

I have seen some kick ass labs doing this type of single and dual purpose work.

Al,
i would suggest the first thing would be to research and decide if you are looking for a working line or a showline puppy. you will get a lot of good avice here on which might be more suitable for you based on your needs, goals and lifestyle.

i have seen young adults bond perfectly with their new family, but if you prefer starting from scratch to do it all yourself, then that is very rewarding (and a lot of work and responsibility!) as long as you are aware of the crapshoot factors, which you are.

i purchased a showline puppy from 2 titled parents (imports), i saw several half and full siblings, i met both parents. i had about 5 months to prepare and read, etc. i am thrilled w/my puppy (now 6 mo) and he is doing VERY well with training, he has confidence, meduim level prey drive (which is exactly what i asked for) and good nerves, and he's gorgeous, and lives in the house. i plan to do Schutzhund as a hobby but want a home protector too, and i needed one that could be trusted around kids, clients, barncats, house cats, horses, goats & an older doxie mix. i knew that a working line dog would be too much for my goals and lifestyle and more than i wanted to sign up for (altho i totally appreciate their abilities!!).

there are great breeders out there for either type. i would talk to several and be VERY clear about what you want. i would ask for references too. make sure the parents have all their health clearances and preferably titled in the discipline/sport/skill you want the puppy for.

goodluck.

jen

oops, typed wrong name. sorry. the above is to the OP.

 Quote: Jeffrey Smith

...........about a year ago i got the opportunity to become a law enforcement officer for our local community. when doing so, I lost most of my day time which made it hard to stick to a well rounded retriever training program (its hard to watch a dog bumber fly in the air 200 yards away in the dark :grini didnt think it was fair to the dog to only train maybe two days a week so i got out of it..

If you don't have enough time for a retriever you won't have enough time for a GSD. The sport of schutzhund will require at least as much devotion from you as your retriever program did, most likely more.