I just purchased the Basic Obedience video, after using a different type of training previously. My dog knows the sit command and the down command, so I haven't regressed to using treats to "teach" him those as instructed in the video, I've started with adding distractions and the stay command, using corrections when necessary. (Never used corrections in any training before, so it's an adjustment for dog and handler)
He's done pretty good, I've only had to administer a few corrections but when I do sometimes his temperment drops without any verbal warning - ears drop, tail droops, etc.. (like it discussed in the video I am trying to praise immediately afterwards to bring his temperment back up to learning level)

My question is that sometimes, most notably after I've corrected him for something, he confuses a sit command for a down command. Example, I'll give a sit command and move around trying to add distractions, he moves, I pop him, praise him, he goes back to the sit and I move/distract again and then release him with lots of praise. If I go back to another sit command, sometimes he goes into a down.
Is this something I need to correct for? Am I correcting too hard? Like I said I haven't gotten a "yelp" out of him, and I don't actually correct very hard because he's not very big and has never had corrections before. But his temperment is what's telling me he's getting the message re: corrections.


Edited to add: I just found a response in the Q&A section regarding the sit/down confusion that helped me out.
If you are not trying to train a competition dog – why worry if the dog sits or lays down? All you really want it to do is stay in one place – sitting or laying down is not a big thing. But if a dog does lay when you ask it to sit – you should not correct it for doing this. The dog is trying to comply with a command from you. The problem is not that she is not being obedient but that it does not understand the command. This is a problem that can be fixed with a lot of praise when she does it right and then if she does lays down – say SIT and gently pull her up to a sit position and give her a treat when she is sitting.

I'm still unsure if I'm correcting to harshly. I'm still re-reading the Q&A section for more answers. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Pam,

Heard of the phrase "go back 2 steps"? I can't say for 100% before seing your dog but personally it sounded like you are going too fast. The dog seams to be confused with what you want it to do and it too seams like a soft nervy dog. Either this or it has come from a history of wrong inprint.

I suggest you go back 3 step and use food, praise and toys to get the puppy more relax and receptive to training. This may have to go on for 4-5 days of nothing but play before you go back to basic on sit until solid then 1 step distance and build up the time from 3 second till 1 minute followed by 2 step build up the time etc. Remember when adding distraction, always increase rewards and praise at success and please set the dog up for success. In other words, if you know he can't do this don't give the command and see him fail. Otherwise the confusion will get the dog nowhere and will not be fair for the dog if you have to re-train him with even more corrections.

Mind to get more reading materials to get more understanding before attempting again? Try purely positive training by shiela booth. Your dog seams to need a lot of positive reinforcement and confidence rather than corrections.

Pam,

If I had to guess I would say that there is a good chance you are over correcting and the dog isn't sure on the commands. Down is the most submissive position the dog can get in to. If the dog is afraid it is the position it will take to demonstrate submission to a stronger "pack member". It also sounds like you are waiting too long to praise at this point. You should praise and/or treat, as soon as the dog is in the proper position.

Most dogs will have a default position. It is usually either sit or down. The default position is the position that the dog assumes if left to it's own choice. It sounds like your dog is a "downer" for it's default position. This will also tend to take the dog in to a down position if it is feeling like there isn't anything going on.

I also notice that you say the dog "isn't very big". How old is the dog and what breed is it? What are you using for a correction collar?

My dog will do the same thing. She is not being trained in competition, so I have been somewhat reluctant to correct her every time. I figure so long as she is down and staying there.....no harm no foul....or is it? Typically when she does the down rather than the sit it is when I have given a strong verbal command with a strong correction. I believe she is going down to offer a submisive repsonse to my command. I find that if I take her and place her in the sit when she does this, followed by praise, she is more likely to sit on the next strong command. When my commands are lighter toned, she sits and downs fine. She only mixes them up when there has been a correction with a demanding verbal command. Where your dog is doing pretty much what I've seen my dog do, try a lighter toned command. Not neccessarily a plea with the dog, but something that gets your point across without threatening the dog. Also as the others said back it up a notch. Since your dog is new to the corrections, start small and work your way up.

just my opinion, but i think the confusion comes from teaching the sit and the down at the same time. i've seen it in my own dogs as well as others. i would suggest using one or the other for a while or in different session, but don't use them in the same session until your dog is very clear on it. good luck.

Stepping back makes wonders.
I don't know the look of your dog when he downs, but if he looks submissive, I think he just quits. If he is dropping a nice happy quick down, when you say 'sit', I think he doesn't really distinguish between the 2 commands. You have to go back teach again. Pay attention to the tone of your voice, for example use high tone for sit and low tone for down, it makes a huge difference for the dog.
Maybe it helps, gradually, to random give the command (something like down-sit; stand-down-sit; stand-down), until the dog gets to do a down from a sit or stand or heel position each and every time, both in front and at your side.

I agree with Ms Powers. I only teach my dog one command at a time for only 1 - 3 minutes at a time.

I train for several weeks with great priase and my dog's favorite treats.

I thin add Corrections, but I still only teach one command at a time.

I am not sure if this is correct but my dog understands what sit is and what down is.


Hope this helps

I always teach sit-down-stand at the same time. Teaching just the sit-down can lead the dog to anticipating. If there is a third command, stand, the dog has to "think" a little more. I've never had a problem with confusing a dog by doing them at the same time. Keep it a game!

that's cool <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" /> that you can train the two together without having a confused dog, but for those of us who can't.....we have to rely on keeping things "mixed-up" so the dog does not anticipate.

Whether you are training the dog for competition or not seems irrelevant to me; sit means sit and down means down. You have elected to train to commands to see two different results, why let some one sway what YOU want from YOUR dog.

If you are going the way of compulsion, stay with one command for a considerable length of time until you are 100% sure your dog is 100% clear and at leat 98% accurate before going forward. I try to aviod training the two too closely together. If there are no time constraints, (trial) don't impose any on yourself.

Have you tried the Flink's motivational methods? Very worth the investment financially and time wise. Good Luck.