Hi,

On Oct. 27th I adopted a cute 20lb. mutt from the shelter. He seemed very sweet and calm. The vet determined him to be about 18 months old. Here are the facts.

On day three he bit my 21 year old daughter. She was playing tug with him. No one else in the house with her, i.e. me or dad. I know...not his fault. He was very vicious about it. Biting her in the back and on the hand enough to draw blood and cause bruising.

He did not behave nicely on his visit to the vet. Needed the muzzle, which because of his short snout did not work well, but we got through the visit.

Quickly had him neutered.

Day ten he bits 25 year old son. Not too much damage, but again not just a bit, but more of attack.

Day eleven I hire expensive trainer with kids college money. This trainer trains with same dog philosophy as Leerburg.

Second trainer visit he bits trainer.

He does not give any warning before biting. He does not like people ( strangers) bending and reaching toward him, that seems to be the trigger.

He gets vicious from his crate when people (not me, dad, or daughter) walk by.

The good things about Curly.

He sits, down, and stays on command. He sits and waits at doors and in and out of car. Now he even checks himself at the door and does not enter before me and waits for the command.

We practice daily ignoring him. We pet him after he has done something worthy.

Daughter now feeds and is comfortable with him and he listens to her pretty good. She will be home from college for next 6 weeks and I hope for her to work on being more in charge of him.

He is on training leash at all times in the house. Guests are instructed not to just enter the house, wait to be let in and then not to talk to the dog or make eye contact.

Once people come in he will go to down stay and then appears all calm and friendy, but if someone makes that wrong move...uh, oh.

Do you think given his willingness to train and he is generally very sweet and calm that he can be rehabilitated? This behavior is not acceptable in my home.

Might he have a temperament or psycho problem that will never be overcome?? Please someone talk to me.

Gail

Your part about " hire expensive trainer w/kids college money" made me laugh. Anyway...hard to tell just from a post on the internet if a dog is "psycho." I would say he is NOT, since you have already determined a trigger.

I don't where this school is that teaches people that the way to approach a dog is to crouch/bend over it all creepy-like and then stick your hand in its face, but if I ever find it, I'm going to burn it down. Dog DO NOT LIKE THIS. Most will not maul you over the offese, but it is very unnatural posture and they do not like it.

Having said that....I hate to be negative...but most dogs in rescues are there for a reason. Not usually their fault, but a reason nonetheless. I think you just discovered his.

Yes, he has a temperament "problem" if it's a problem to you. That's largely what determines if it's a problem or not. You've stated that this is unacceptable in your home; don't accept it. You haven't said what any of the victims did after the attack. It's equally important to know what EXACTLY happened before, during, after these episodes to tell you much more. If he got away with it, he'll repeat it. Simple dog "psychology" (or child or any kind of animal for that matter).

If you could expand on a few of the incidents, I think that might help. As far as setting him straight...I think you need to be careful until you are 100% you understand the root of the behavior. Different causes have different fixes. I would watch diligently with an open mind to see how he's doing...and of course keep him safely contained around anyone not willing to be attacked for the sake of a behavioral study. LOL. Seriously, keep him crated since a muzzle won't work.

Edited to add- how long did you have him before you saw any of these problems?

What are people doing while he's in his crate to make him flip out? Are they looking at him? Or does he go ballistic from them walking back and forth minding their own business?

Jenni,

First, thank you so much for answering. Here are more Curly facts.

Had him only three days on the first bit. Daughter was playing with a toy and he seemed to get carried away and ended up attacking. Dad put him in crate and attended to dog bite on daughter. Daughter did not want us to return or put the dog down. We talked about her and vet about needing to assert her place in the family "This is her house, etc." She must follow the ignore rules, no letting him up on her bed. She has done very well. She feeds him and he will do sit, down and stay at doorways for her.

Son does not live at our house and is not comfortable with the dog. He must let us know when he is coming over. Dog is in sit, down, stay when he comes in. Sometimes he will be growling in this position. I don't like that.

Crate is in my office next to my computer. He likes his crate. No problem getting him in. Daughter's boyfriend entered room while I was at computer and dog in crate. Instant crazy dog. I firmly, but calmly told him no. After a few attempts, he quieted and laid down calm. Praised dog. Daughter entered room, hug from boyfriend, crazy dog. More calm no's and downs. He did do it. We repeated this scenario a couple of times. He did OK. We stood in the room and talked and laughed and touched so he could see this was all fine. This is why I think there might be hope. He is only 18 months old. Although he is only 20 lbs. his mouth and head are big and he locks on.

Gail

I can't comment about the 'psycho' part either, but I tend to agree with Jenni. He has a clear trigger and you know what it is, so in that way, anyway, he's somewhat predictable.

When I have a dog with a trigger, I tend to not trigger them. I will gradually try to desensitize them if it makes sense for the situation, but do so VERY slowly. But Jenni is also right that dogs HATE the approach you describe (bending forward, hand out). Curly just expresses his displeasure more forcefully than some, but I would be more inclined here to disallow people to approach him (or any dog) this way.

I like how you are managing this with your family. I would not have other people in and out of the house while this dog is not in a crate though, at least not yet. You don't want to give any chance for "uh oh" to happen.

It doesn't sound like you've had Curly very long. I would let him learn how to behave, get acclimated with your family, and develop a clear understanding of the rules before you add the pressure of interaction with guests. When that time comes, I would probably use a basket muzzle as an insurance policy. It's great that you keep him on a leash.

It doesn't sound hopeless to me at all, just sounds like it will take some management and time.

 Quote: Gail Zemantic

Jenni,

Son does not live at our house and is not comfortable with the dog. He must let us know when he is coming over. Dog is in sit, down, stay when he comes in. Sometimes he will be growling in this position. I don't like that.

Perhaps use the basket muzzle when son visits so that everyone can relax, lessening the overall tension in the house. Maybe if the people can relax, the dog can relax a bit too.

If the dog is fixating and growling, get the dog's attention and reward him for not growling and looking at you. Feed him something good through the muzzle. Do the exercise every time your son is around so that the association with your son becomes positive.

Thank you both. These are great suggestions. A properly fitted (I hope) basket muzzle is on order. I can tell that meeting new people is very stressful for him. I really want people to be able to come and go without them or him feeling uncomfortable.

He is such a good dog in every way, except for the biting, which is huge.

I have only had him for six weeks and I do think we can give him more time with all the precautions you suggest. Dad and I can spend lots of time training since we are empty nesters.

 Quote: Gail Zemantic

I really want people to be able to come and go without them or him feeling uncomfortable.

I think that this goal is possible in time, but he needs the opportunity to gain some confidence first. It sounds like you are in a great position to help him with that

If you had tiny children in the house, I would have a different recommendation, but as you say you are empty-nesters w/grown children, and he definitely seems to be responsive and improving, I think this is certainly doable w/a lot of time and effort.

I hesitate to say too much more because just from what you've said, it's difficult to pinpoint exactly what his motive stems from (fear, dominance, buttheadedness, etc.) though regardless, he's highly reactive, so of course this must be dealt with.

Keep doing as you are and incorporate some of Kristel's suggestions, and I think you will see some more improvement. DO NOT GET COMFORTABLE and stop w/the regime just because he seems better. He may be a dog you have to treat this way for a long, long time, if not forever. Not trying to sound negative, but be realistic and err on the side of caution. The very last thing a dog like this needs is to see inconsistency. This type will be all over it and you will have twice as hard of a time the second time around.

I am committed to training him. I believe in a well trained dog. A dog is after all a dog. I think I just needed to hear that there is hope. I, of course, have been the "b*tch" making all adhere to the rules. I have noticed that when the rules relax and he's "daddy's baby" that's when things happen. He was rescued in every sense of the word. He is warm, fed, and loved.

Thanks so much for your advice.

Jenni, I love the pic of your dog.

Thanks, Gail. Caleb says thank you for the compliment also.;-)

Yes, that's typical; when the rules relax, a dog like this will assume the position of decision-maker, and given his track record, this is not a good thing, LOL. Be a leader, guide, disciplinarian, teacher, etc...don't be a pushover. If "Daddy" can't obey the rules, put a prong collar on him.