During the "early" stages in bite training at what point should I out the sleeve and at what point should the helper slip it for him. Also when I do out him on the sleeve and give him the heel command he doesn't listen because his drive is so high, any other time he knows the command very well, what should i do for better obedience?
I don't know if there is more current school of thought but I have never been in a hurry to teach the out. I would rather spend a good portion of time developing the grip. I slip the sleeve a good bit especially if I've put a good bit of pressure on the dog. This actually has to be read by the decoy or handler. For a psd or pp dog it is imperative though to civil agitate the dog after the dog releases the sleeve. You don't want the dog to become fixated on equipment. Also the dog should not be allowed to mouth the sleeve when it has been slipped. Keep his head up and keep him moving. The decoy should be poised and ready to reagitate as soon as the dog releases the sleeve. Your job is to be a tree (not a weeping willow but s strong oak). The decoy needs to know where his boundaries are in order to be effective. Certainly there is more to this but the name of the game is to instill confidence.
For a sport dog, you shouldn't out the dog until after he has learned the hold and bark, because that is the default behavior after the out. Teach it in the wrong order and the dog won't know what to do after letting go.
I made an assumption that she was talking about a person protection dog. I guess protection training covers more than just a psd or pp dog. It's been a long time since I trained a sport dog. I will definately have to brush up on the order of things.
Another thought in reference to the heeling difficulties because of the high drive is to place the sleeve on the ground and do obedience around it. When you feel that you have re-established some control you can have a decoy wear the sleeve while you heal the dog. when he is in the proper position you can release him for a bite as a reward. When done right this can be a lot of fun and lead to some flashy obedience.
So I should constantly slip the sleeve? At what point in our training should I start to out the sleeve? what signs should I look for. also with the obedience training around the sleeve, he minds well with it just out in the open it's when we go he goes into prey drive he doesn't listen.
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