Hi All,

I wanted to say, I have been reading this forum for over a year and have decided to join. I would like to say you guys are friendly and to the point, That is EXTREMELY helpful.

That said, I was wondering if some of you would take a second to post a list of the most popular breeds in Narco work. Not a dual PP or Police Working K-9 but just detection.

Thanks in advance!

Welcome! With a question like that, breed suggestions should vary for a million reasons regarding thousands of individual dogs. A good friend of mine is a K-9 cop, and he says the best sniffer he ever had was a (in his words "dumb") golden retriever! So much has to do with the individual dog, but I bet you could get the average shelter hound mix to be great at the task.

As for breeds who are usually employed doing that, Wikipedia names these: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_police_dog_breeds#Illicit_substance_detection_dogs

I was surprised the bloodhound isn't on that list, or that we haven't selectively bred drug-sniffing bloodhounds.

The majority of single purpose dogs I've seen at border entries and ferry crossings here locally have been labs. When I asked why that would be the case I was informed that they very simply were favored for passive detection.

I also imagine they function exceptionally well in our wet weather.

Having been a military and police trainer for a good number of years, I've found Labs, have been the most prominent. In the past few years, there seems to be a considerable number of Mals that won't make it as patrol dogs, but certainly have the drives necessary for detection work. Pedigrees, ancestory etc aren't necessarily important for military and police work. Most of us aren't into breeding dogs, we just want dogs that will work. Our department has a large number of single purpose dogs. 15 of the single purpose detectors have come from rescues, dog pounds and shelters. Mostly Labs, although I do have one Chessie, a couple of Goldens and a uhh, uhh, "mixed" terrier.

DFrost

Thanks for all who have participated. I wish I could use more "terriers" because they often times have the tenacity you would want. I was told they were unmarketable. I am happy to see you list that!!! I did actually pick up a Lab 10 months old from a rescue that had seemingly all the drives, after looking at 30+.....Amazing I know. I have ordered the raising a working puppy DVD to make sure i do it right and I already have Drive and Focus, to enhance his drive. His drive is currently directed towards balls only. Do you think 10 mos is too young to start training?

I actually have thought of selectively breeding for the scent dogs. I think if you raise the puppies right with the right drives you could have a great pool of scent dogs..... I am not law enforcement and have the time to spend. So, I am hearing to invest in Labs... I was actually thinking Lab and some sort of hound mix...

David, Since you are/were LE, I have heard Aussie's (australian shepherds) aren't wanted because of thier coat maintenance. Do you agree?

What are you going to do with the wash outs?
Also, to replicate any reliable performance traits and abilities takes generations...you are going to be lucky if even 1 out of a litter makes the selection....What are you going to do with the rest of the litter?
I ask this because I bred a litter that not one made the cut out of...now there were 9 dogs to find homes for...................
Wouldn't do that again for sure...especially not with crossing different breeds...you end up with unmarketable mutts in rescue groups.
I would think it would be better to find young adults that make the first selection cut and go from there....you yourself said you had to go through 30 just to find one that you thought was even suitable to start training....no guarantee he will finish the training.
That's a lot of puppy litters and time for them to grow into adults to see if their temperament and ability are even a possibility.
just sayin....

 Quote:

I actually have thought of selectively breeding for the scent dogs. I think if you raise the puppies right with the right drives you could have a great pool of scent dogs..... I am not law enforcement and have the time to spend. So, I am hearing to invest in Labs... I was actually thinking Lab and some sort of hound mix..

Many, many, many dogs have a nose suited for detection work. Dogs have over 220 million scent receptors compared to a person's 5 million or so. It is the drive to work that sets breeds apart. Labs were bred for gun dogs, well bred labs are eager to work, eager to please, medium sized, solid nerved, sociable dogs with good drive. This is why they excel at detection work - not because their nose is so superior to other breeds.

I really don't see any point in trying to start another breed for detection work. You can take just about any sociable, solid nerved, high drive dog and train it for that sort of thing. I could probably scout around for a week or two and find 50+ breeders of working dogs (of various breeds) that could provide a person with a pup suitable for doing detection work.

 Quote: lori shanks

I did actually pick up a Lab 10 months old from a rescue that had seemingly all the drives, after looking at 30+.....Amazing I know.

Do you think 10 mos is too young to start training?

I actually have thought of selectively breeding for the scent dogs.

I have heard Aussie's (australian shepherds) aren't wanted because of thier coat maintenance. Do you agree?

It doesn't surprise me that you looked at 30+ dogs before finding one you want. I fear the Lab has gone the same route as most American bred GSD's. I've never seen so many Labradors that won't retrieve. Demand also plays a large role in availability. Prior to 9/11 a good Lab could be purchased for a few hundred dollars. Those days are long gone. I'm fortunate to be able to find so many good ones in rescues, pounds and shelters.

A major university and the Federal Government both have breeding programs. Their success rate depends on who you ask. Fifty percent seems to be a good number. Like someone else stated, even at 50% (which I personally feel is an inflated number) you still have a lot of dogs that will need homes or some disposition. While selective breeding does increase the odds, there is no certainty with each puppy.

I don't think 10 months is too young - depending on the dog - depending on the training. IT's still a puppy so a trainer has to keep that in mind. I prefer 18 months. I'm an operational trainer, I have to have results in the shortest possible times. To that end, puppies bore me and I just don't have the time waiting for them to mature.

I don't have any Aussies, nor do I have the experience with Aussies to answer your question. Your question did make me take a quick second look and then gave me a chuckle. I have a handler named "Aussie". My first thought was - He has a shaved head but always looks sharp in uniform. ha ha

One comment I've made hundreds of times and always make when asked about purchasing dogs for police service work; I approach each vendor like I would a used car salesman. Sure they have some good products to sell - - just make sure, when you purchase one, you get one of the good ones. There are a lot of lemons on that lot.

DFrost

I agree with the above statements. I have not started a breeding program, and I was just thinking out loud. One of the most heartbreaking things to do is look for a rescue with drives and pass up the ones scheduled for euthanization.


I apologize if I lit your fire.......

I will think more before I write!!

Mr. Frost,

I sincerely appreciate the time you are taking to answer my questions.

I realize you don't like puppies, but if you were to get one at 10 mos of age....would you crate him and only work drive building? How would you proceed with him.

I am taking a class, for certification so I can obtain a DEA Researcher's permit. It looks like I can still get one here in GA.

My class starts in a month, so, until that month passes, what would you do with this pup to keep his drives up and maybe improve them?

I tested him at a public place with tons of noise, sounds, people he saw and wanted nothing but this ball.

so I want to try and keep him that way.

Again, thanks for your time,

Also, I think I read where you used to live near me....Newnan. Do you know of any expert that will help me on my path to "greatness" )

All I'd do is play ball, perhaps some hide and seek. Never to the point the dog gives up. Never so easy all he has to do is chase the ball and bring it back. Make him work a little. It's a play by ear game. You try to do all the dog will take, never anything more. Hope that explains it.

DFrost