I'm new to this forum so I hope I posted this in the right place. I currently have 4 dogs, 1 male GSD (7 months, neutered),
2 male GSD mixes (rescues, around a year old, neutered), 1 female australian cattle dog (3 yrs, spayed). Everyone gets along and I haven't had a single dog fight so far. Having said that I fully realise the boys are adolesants and there's no pack hiarchy yet.

The only problem I'm having is that when I try and work the GSD puppy with another dog being handled by my husband he fixates on the other dog and completely ignores me. I know the obvious solution would be to work him alone but we've just enrolled him and one of the rescues in group OB class to try and socialise them. The entire class is spent with him screaming and pulling on the leash trying to get to his packmate. No matter how hard I correct him he's oblivious to it. I'd prefer to try and work through this as opposed to taking the easy way out and pulling one of them from the class. He's ignoring all the other dogs in class.

However if that's the ONLY solution do I seperate him from the other dogs completely or can he still be allowed to play with them when I'm not working with him ? When he's alone, he's fine and responds very well to anything I ask of him. Any advice would be appreciated !

If the class is big enough (I mean the training space) you can work the dogs at opposite ends of the space. If it's outside - give yourselves plenty of room from each other. If it's not, can you take a class at a different time/day for now?

All of these dogs should have alone time OB everyday - and they should have each other as distractions (as well as other distractions) added in slowly. By slowly I mean, the dog you are working needs to be as far away as does NOT illicit a reaction and he/she is able to maintain a focus on you. Then you slowly move closer as the dog becomes desensitized. You can use the search engine to look up desensitization to learn more.

At this point, I would have very well supervised "together" time a few times a week but other than that these dogs need to be seperated until you can reliably call them away from each other. I have 4 dogs and when we are out hiking or just in the yard - they do socialize together - but one word from me and they all come running because I am way more fun to them than they are to each other. All of your time with the dogs "together" should be hiking, leashed walking type deals - not them playing together and you doing your own thing.

Three of your dogs are VERY close in age and are all still in need of a lot of OB training and reinforcement. It is going to be a lot of work to get them all working for you and ignoring each other.

Thank you for the advice. The 2 rescues came to me with serious behavioural issues and are a constant work in progress. I thought if I got a pup and gave him a proper start in life I'd have an easier time training him. What I didn't take into consideration was them bonding to each other instead of me...lol. My cattle dog was my farm dog and constant shadow before we adopted the boys so she's more then happy to work for me and could care less what anyone else was doing.

I think taking seperate classes is the best solution and getting solid OB with the 3 boys before trying to work with them together is also an excellent idea. They're far from ready to work under any distrations at this point and it wasn't fair on my part to expect otherwise from the GSD pup. When they're ready I'll start intoducing them to more distractions and slowly increase them. I've let them hang out together both in the house and outside in the yard without direct interaction from me. But I'll follow your advice there too.

The other problem I have is that I'm in northern Ontario and we don't have any local trainers up here apart from one who only does basic OB. Getting advice and help with my motley crue of canine delinquints is difficult to say the least so I'm happy to have found this forum.

 Quote: Angie Hall

My cattle dog was my farm dog and constant shadow before we adopted the boys so she's more then happy to work for me and could care less what anyone else was doing.

The other problem I have is that I'm in northern Ontario and we don't have any local trainers up here apart from one who only does basic OB. Getting advice and help with my motley crue of canine delinquints is difficult to say the least so I'm happy to have found this forum.

This is key, imho. Before you added other dogs to your pack, you had a dog whose focus was on you.

You added other dogs, but perhaps no pack structure, and the dogs learned to focus on each other.

You don't really need outside trainers. Read the info on this forum and go back to what you did when you had one dog.... You were the center of her universe.

Look at the attraction to the other dog as a level three distraction.
You don't show the dog a level three distraction till the dog is solid on levels one and two.
It breaks down that easy!

Holy Crap...Barbara's comment about going back to doing what I was doing with Dakota (my ACD) really hit home. That's the answer...I've been soooo focused on the other 2 boys and their "issues" that I've completely neglected this puppy ! Other then taking him out on leash to do OB every day, he's been left alone. I haven't been interacting with him one on one like I was the other dogs. When it was only Dakota she had my undivided attention everyday, all day and she's a darn good dog !

What's ironic is I bought this puppy with the hopes of doing tracking and possibly even SAR if he really showed an aptitude for it. Well from today forth, that'll change. I'll have to bond with him FIRST before I can expect him to work for me. It's funny how it takes someone else pointing out the obvious to make things "click" .... lol.

After reading the article about why raising two puppies at the same is a bad idea, I wanted to clarify. Yes, I've been letting the dogs hang out together in the house and outside without direct interaction from me (playing with them ect.) BUT it's always supervised. The slightest look, or aggressive body posture and I'm right there to stop it before it escalates. All four are crated when we're not home and from now on they'll have seperate "free time" one on one with me.

Something else I've learned is that with a baby coming in April,2011 I'd better get on the ball here and fast. I know that's another thread entirely...lol.

The two rescues were going to be rehabed and rehomed initially but my husband and two step sons are so attached to them that I can't do that to them with a clear conscience. When I've mentioned it there's been tears and a passionate arguement about why they can't be placed...lol. The first one was a cruelty seizure and he was abused and then left tied to a tree to starve to death as a puppy. At 6 months he weighed 23 lbs and he's now a healthy 50 lbs at just over a year (his age was a guesstimate). The second one is a white gsd and what appears to be sibe mix. He was too much dog for his first owner and she allowed him to run loose with a pack of semi-feral dogs for almost a year. He's always going to be a work in progress but he's come around a lot better then I ever thought he would. When I brought him home he was the most dominant dog I've ever worked with. He knew nothing about interacting with people other then they fed him sometimes. Doing serious OB work with him as made a huge difference, as well as giving him a very structured daily routine. I've also let my step sons handle him under close supervision of course and he's slowly learning to respect them as well. I know that getting the GSD puppy was a bad idea with everything else going on around here, but at the time I really didn't plan on the rescues being permanent.