I have a nearly 6 month old Malinois puppy who has been eating raw since coming home at 7weeks. I think she got about a cup of kibble in a treat ball at one point, but other than that and training treats, she is on a raw. She was getting a variety of beef, turkey and chicken, but it turns out either she was getting too much chicken or she's a bit allergic to it. So for now that's been cut out.

So my concern is that out of a litter of 8, and compared to the three other puppy owners I am in contact with, she is the largest. All of the others are kibble fed. It was my understanding that raw fed dogs usually matured more slowly, but so far she has been leaps and bounds ahead of the others. Last time I measured her, she was 24" at the shoulder and at that point she weighed 44 lbs, I weighed her 9 days later and she is up to 48. When she was 44lbs, her closest competitor was the original runt of the litter who was 40, and then there was one who was 23" and 35lbs and another was significantly smaller.

My main concern is that she is growing too fast and any skeletal troubles that could result. She was the slowest for her teeth to start falling out and it took her the longest to get them all in. Can anyone help put my mind at ease? She currently gets about 2lbs a day plus a minimal amount of training treats consisting of freeze dried beef liver or salmon and red barn beef food roll. The treats are not enough to add much to her diet and at this point she is very lean, almost to the point where I am thinking about increasing her food, again my concern is giving her too much and causing her to grow too fast.

She is the first puppy I've raised and I know I'm being paranoid. Oh, and her mother weighs in the 70's and her dad is 84lbs. Of the 4, she looks the most like her parents.

Should I be concerned about her size?

First, let's back up.


How are you providing the required digestible bone if you have cut out chicken?

Please give us details of a typical meal. I'm not taking issue with 2 pounds -- but what is the 2 pounds made up of?

Also, how was "too much chicken" or "allergy" diagnosed? Did the dog have itchy skin? Ear infections? Or was it more like a sensitivity, maybe from injected additives?


Also, what is her body condition like?

I don't think you should be concerned. She's in a growth spurt, which is natural. The raw diet you're feeding is ideal--and much better for her than the "puppy formula" kibble diets that have artificially inflated amounts of calcium and calories. Those are the things that make large breed puppies grow too quickly. So don't give her any calcium supplements, and don't over-feed her. Otherwise, carry on.

As long as she remains lean, she will grow as fast and ultimately as large as her individual genetics intended. The crazy growth spurts will slow down in the next few months, and you'll start to see slower, steadier growth--which won't be complete until she's two or so.

ETA: Indeed. my encouragement is based on an assumption that your raw diet is correctly balanced bone-to-meat. Connie's questions have to be satisfied first.

Her issue with the chicken was itchiness, redness on her belly, chewing hair on the skin flap that hangs down on her back legs(sorry not sure what else to call it), chewing hair on her thighs and insides of her thighs were had half inch areas of redness that started oozing a bit of yellowish. Ears, feet and poop were all fine. Upon feeding her only turkey for 48hrs, redness started clearing and sores started healing. Within a week no noticeable redness, no sores and hair started coming back. At this point it's been about two weeks and you can't tell she ever had an issue. The problem could very well have been from injected additives because I hadn't been able to feed the chicken I normally feed from the wholesale meat distributor. She was getting cut up chicken from the grocery store, anywhere from half to a quarter. She had about two straight weeks of it, with only a few days of other protien variety. I plan on rotating chicken back in and monitoring to see if I get a reaction again.

Yesterday she had a turkey neck in the AM, a turkey butt, heart, liver and gizzard mid day and a turkey neck in the PM. Some days she will also get a turkey thigh (about twice a week) instead of a neck. I haven't given her a beef meal in the last few weeks while I was trying to get her itchies cleared up, but she has gotten marrow bones and when she does get beef, it's often a blend of heart kidney and tripe, ribs or heart or liver/kidney. She also was getting eggs which I have cut out for right now.

As far as body condition, she has good muscle tone, is certainly in the lanky puppy stage, very thick solid feeling dog, hair coat is good, teeth/ears are good and odor free, I just took some pictures, I will try to post them

OK. I was afraid you might have gone to a not-enough-bone diet by cutting out chicken. (Marrow bones are recreational, really, and not what I consider part of the diet. The dog gets the necessary calcium from digestible bones.)

http://leerburg.com/feedingarawdiet.htm#RMB

No problems with turkey thigh? I don't read much about other folks seeing turkey thigh bones coming out in kinda big chunks, but I've experienced it with a couple of dogs.

PS Nothing about the weight, the growth spurt, etc., triggered my inquisition.

I just always look deeper when anyone says "stopped raw chicken" because it's trickier to get the digestible bone into a no-chicken diet.

I'm not sure how to have the picture show up here, but here are two links

http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/8EQ4THlrXfm7VBTKymxz6-yO11ptWgc67VqVwyGVZz0?feat=directlink

http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/sV1Vfyiwh_0Za0_TrhhXX-yO11ptWgc67VqVwyGVZz0?feat=directlink

Her hips are easily felt as are her ribs.

Oh, wow, I would so not be concerned!



I'm not a puppy expert at all, but do other folks think that those legs presage a dog who is just gonna be tall?



eta

Or maybe they all have a colt-period like that?

Ok, the link reminded me, she also gets pork necks, but hasn't gotten them since her case ran out. I also don't consider marrow bones a source of bone, nor do I consider ribs because she doesn't actually ingest them.

I haven't had any problems with turkey thighs, turkey drumsticks, she normally won't eat the entire bone or will break it up, lick out the marrow and leave the bone. The drumsticks worry me a bit, so she doesn't get them too often. I have had the bone chunks come out with turkey drumsticks and dogs in the past.

Do you think I'm doing ok bone wise with the turkey necks?

She looks great to me. All legs, just like most 6-month olds. She's beautiful!

One of my favorite bone-in items is duck necks. If you can find a place that has them they are super cheap, a bit smaller than turkey necks--and it provides another protein source besides chicken and turkey (both of which I also use a lot)

Best way to tell if you've got the amount of bone right is to watch poop, as fun as that is. Dry, crumbly, pellet-like, or hard-to-produce are all signs of too much bone for sure. Too soft could be many things--but not enough bone is one of them.

In my experience, the right ratio is about half RMB (raw meaty bones), and about half boneless meat. Depends on what it is---turkey necks are pretty bony. But "about" half and half is right more often than not.

 Quote: Tracy Collins

She looks great to me. All legs, just like most 6-month olds. She's beautiful!

Yeah, she sure is!

I just don't know a lot of 6-month-old dogs. That all-legs look is funny as well as endearing.