phaedra rieff wrote 01/01/2011 06:48 PM Empty Stomach Syndrome #309684 - 01/01/2011 06:48 PM
phaedra rieff Webboard User Reg: 07-15-2010 Posts: 741 Loc: bc, canada Offline	So today I mentioned to one of the vets I work with that Faroh occasionally vomits bile in the morning (about once every 2 weeks). He seems 100% normal when it happens, otherwise. She said that it is probably a condition called "Empty Stomach Syndrome", in which some dogs can't handle having an empty stomach for more than a certain amount of time. The bile pools in the stomach, and causes them to vomit first thing in the morning. He does wake up like clockwork whining and whining every morning about 5:45am, and gets fed almost immediately. Today was a vomit day, and I didn't get him out of the crate until 7am. She said it is fairly common, and I'm wondering if anyone has a dog with this condition, or if certain breeds are predisposed to it?
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Connie Sutherland wrote 01/01/2011 06:51 PM Re: Empty Stomach Syndrome [Re: phaedra rieff ] #309685 - 01/01/2011 06:51 PM
Connie Sutherland Moderator Reg: 07-13-2005 Posts: 31571 Loc: North-Central coast of California Offline	There are lots of threads here about this common condition. Many folks deal with it by holding back some of the last meal of the day and giving it as a bedtime snack. eta I've read that it's most common in small, "nervous" or volatile, breeds, but this isn't my experience at all. IME, it's not breed-specific. Edited by Connie Sutherland (01/01/2011 06:54 PM) Edit reason: eta
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phaedra rieff wrote 01/01/2011 06:59 PM Re: Empty Stomach Syndrome [Re: Connie Sutherland ] #309686 - 01/01/2011 06:59 PM
phaedra rieff Webboard User Reg: 07-15-2010 Posts: 741 Loc: bc, canada Offline	Thanks Connie. I had actually been feeding him earlier and earlier, thinking that he was waking up and whining so much because he needs to go outside. When I first got him, I let him eat much later, and he actually slept much later. So, I guess it's possible that he might be nauseous, or have some sort of heartburn in the morning...
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JessicaKromer wrote 01/01/2011 07:00 PM Re: Empty Stomach Syndrome [Re: Connie Sutherland ] #309687 - 01/01/2011 07:00 PM
JessicaKromer Webboard User Reg: 10-28-2006 Posts: 991 Loc: CA Offline	Hav does it too. Annoying for me, icky for him. I do what Connie mentioned and give a little bit of food before bed and he is usually much better. Jessica
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Anne Jones wrote 01/01/2011 07:34 PM Re: Empty Stomach Syndrome [Re: JessicaKromer ] #309689 - 01/01/2011 07:34 PM
Anne Jones Webboard User Reg: 04-29-2004 Posts: 3825 Loc: Northeast Offline	Battled with this on & off for a couple of years with my female. She is more prone to it than my males have been, for whatever reason. But a few years ago I started to give them a Buddy Biscuit dog cookie ( I like that I can get these without any wheat or soy etc in them)at bedtime & that seems to do the trick. Just something in their stomache to absorb some of the acid thru the night & early am. I usually feed a couple of hours after we get up as I need time to run them & then let them chill about an hour before feeding. I won't work them for a couple of hours after feeding & I won't feed until an or so after working them. MY DOGS...MY RULES
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phaedra rieff wrote 01/01/2011 10:18 PM Re: Empty Stomach Syndrome [Re: Anne Jones ] #309706 - 01/01/2011 10:18 PM
phaedra rieff Webboard User Reg: 07-15-2010 Posts: 741 Loc: bc, canada Offline	I tried doing training in the morning before feeding. But, being that Faroh is still a pup, he is just so ravenous, it's really useless. He can't focus for a moment, and really bites at my hands to get the lure/reward. Due to his personality, I can't participate in that behaviour. He's crazy for food, and now for his ball, any time of day, so I give him breakfast as soon as he is done his business. I will try a half cup of kibble before bed, and see if that helps.
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Juliana McCabe wrote 01/01/2011 11:09 PM Re: Empty Stomach Syndrome [Re: phaedra rieff ] #309708 - 01/01/2011 11:09 PM
Juliana McCabe Webboard User Reg: 11-21-2008 Posts: 279 Loc: Akron, Ohio Offline	Cicero did this as a puppy as well but seems to have grown out of it as I can't recall the last time it happened. Not sure if this is really something that can be outgrown but haven't had any issues in a while
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Cheri Grissom wrote 01/02/2011 07:55 AM Re: Empty Stomach Syndrome [Re: phaedra rieff ] #309723 - 01/02/2011 07:55 AM
Cheri Grissom Webboard User Reg: 09-30-2010 Posts: 2609 Loc: Michigan Offline	I'm very familiar with it. My previous dog was doing this on a semi-regular basis when she was young. The vet thought it was probably empty stomach syndrome and suggested we feed her later in the evening, or give her a bedtime snack. We moved her dinner time from 5:30 p.m. to 8:00 p.m. That cured the problem. With the two dogs I have now, we initially tried moving dinner time up to an earlier time slot, but again experienced occasional morning vomiting from both of them, so now they eat at 7:30 p.m. and again, problem gone. For what it's worth, all of these dogs have been Dobermans, but I haven't owned any other breeds to compare. I would tend to believe it's not really breed-connected.
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Melissa Hoyer wrote 01/02/2011 08:12 AM Re: Empty Stomach Syndrome [Re: Cheri Grissom ] #309725 - 01/02/2011 08:12 AM
Melissa Hoyer Webboard User Reg: 05-09-2005 Posts: 1340 Loc: SE Michigan Offline	I have experience with this as well. All three of my GSDs have done it at one time or another. My adults get a couple treats at bedtime, usually something like a few milkbone type things. The pup has been doing this more often (he is now 7 months/65 lbs) so he gets about 1/2 to 2/3 cup of kibble at bedtime. This seems to solve the problem. Also, while I understand the theory behind training a hungry dog, this generally doesn't work for me. I end up with a frantically hungry dog who is just too overboard.
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phaedra rieff wrote 01/02/2011 08:29 AM Re: Empty Stomach Syndrome [Re: Cheri Grissom ] #309730 - 01/02/2011 08:29 AM
phaedra rieff Webboard User Reg: 07-15-2010 Posts: 741 Loc: bc, canada Offline	Well, I don't know what to think because last night I gave him half a cup of food right when I put him in the crate for bed at 10:30pm. This morning I was awoken by the sound of vomiting (it's horrible really, how much he wretches), at 4am. There was just a tiny little wet spot on the crate pad. Then at 6am, he still threw a fit to go outside... so I guess I'm not getting out of that one so easy. Was the meal I gave him not big enough? Because he eats multiple times a day, plus training, there is only so much food I can give him at once. eta: This is the first time he has ever vomited 2 days in a row. It is also the first time, in a long time that he has not had any yogurt or bio-k in several days.
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