 Another odd barking question
#328631 - 04/20/2011 01:13 PM |
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OK, I have another "odd" question about Darwin's barking - but I promise I'm absolutely serious.
He's pretty good - he knows perfectly well what "No bark!" means, even if he can't always control himself. But my 14 year old son is very loud too - lots of shouting, whooping, etc - and I'm wondering what Darwin thinks that Benji doesn't get the same verbal correction that he does. I don't really think he would get offended, but perhaps it is hard for him to figure out the social rules if one member of his pack is allowed to "bark" and he isn't. Do you think he would react to "no bark" more consistently if we used it for our kids too? As to whether it would help with Benji, I think that's a cert.
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 Re: Another odd barking question
[Re: Arik Kershenbaum ]
#328640 - 04/20/2011 01:40 PM |
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I think it's perfectly appropriate for there to be different household rules for dogs and humans. I assume Darwin is also not permitted to smoke, borrow your watch, drive the car or sit at the dinner table.
I don't think he is at all confused between his barking and your son's shouting. He does not think he is a person.
Cinco | Jack | Fanny | Ellie | Chip | Deacon |
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Re: Another odd barking question
[Re: Tracy Collins ]
#328646 - 04/20/2011 01:55 PM |
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Wait...
I'm not supposed to let Danke eat at the table?
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Re: Another odd barking question
[Re: Aaron Myracle ]
#328647 - 04/20/2011 01:57 PM |
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Depends on proficiency with utensils, napkins, etc.
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Re: Another odd barking question
[Re: Connie Sutherland ]
#328649 - 04/20/2011 02:02 PM |
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I'm not supposed to let Roger smoke?
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Re: Another odd barking question
[Re: Ross Rapoport ]
#328653 - 04/20/2011 02:10 PM |
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Sorry, Arik. We're having fun and you asked a serious question.
No. In my opinion, I don't think that you need to give the same verbal corrections to your dog and son to avoid confusing the dog.
Like you, I'm also a fan of the notion of the people in the family being the dog's "pack"--there's probably some truth in it. Dogs do look to us for the kind of leadership they might get in an actual dog pack, etc. But they don't think we are dogs and don't expect us to behave like dogs. The best we can do is to establish clearly understood rules and routines for them that provide them a sense of order and structure--which I believe dogs find comforting.
If you believe that Darwin understands the command "No bark" but doesn't always obey it...then he either doesn't understand it, really--or you aren't being consistent in your enforcement of the rule. Which is a far worse breech of "pack leadership etiquette" than not correcting the human child. Darwin expects consistency from you.
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Re: Another odd barking question
[Re: Tracy Collins ]
#328655 - 04/20/2011 02:15 PM |
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Tracy, I think your first answer was perfect. There wasn't a need to respond to thread beyond that, you summed it up perfectly in the first post.
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Re: Another odd barking question
[Re: Aaron Myracle ]
#328671 - 04/20/2011 02:41 PM |
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Well now, I appreciate both the serious and the frivolous answers, but I think there is more to this question than meets the eye.
If dogs see humans as their pack, but not as dogs, then somewhere between those two extremes is where dogs perceive the difference between us. If we understand where they see the difference, then we can communicate better with them.
Similarly, concerning consistency, every time we demand of dogs to act against their nature, we're pushing uphill. Sometimes it's necessary, but it makes our work harder. Dogs bark at intruders. Is it better to be "consistent" and demand that they never do so? On the other hand, we could we expect only partial compliance - at the cost of possibly confusing them with inconsistency.
I'm not a professional dog trainer, and I have little experience of dogs at all (3 years with Darwin), but it is kind of my job to ask these questions and understand what makes them who they are.
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Re: Another odd barking question
[Re: Arik Kershenbaum ]
#328685 - 04/20/2011 03:18 PM |
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You have very thoughtful questions. I think you'd enjoy the writings of two authors that are among my favorites: Patricia McConnell and Temple Grandin--both of whom have written several books about the way animals think, and the way humans interact with animals.
Perhaps others here will have a different answer about your original question.
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Re: Another odd barking question
[Re: Arik Kershenbaum ]
#328686 - 04/20/2011 03:19 PM |
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if you applied that thinking to all things dog, you would have a battle on your hands.
Im allowed to pee inside, Tucker isn't.
Im allowed to go into the fridge and get something out, Tucker isn't.(trust me, he would if he could!)
Im allowed to sleep in the bed, Tucker isn't.
My friends & BF can pee in the house, Tucker can't.
My friends & BF can take something off my plate, Tucker can't.
etc etc...
I don't think dogs really see us or think of us as another form of a dog, just like we don't look at them as another form of human beings.
Don't complain....TRAIN!!! |
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