I am new to this site. I've been frantic ever since coming home from the vet yesterday. He put a muzzle on my 6 month old shib inu because he growled at him. I asked him if training would help. He said that we can try Clomicalm pill therapy and training but he is not hopeful. I am now very scared that I will end up putting him down after reading this site. I had no idea fear biters were a product of poor breeding and are viewed as almost hopeless. Can anyone tell me of any successful cases. Tanner is only 6 months and my husband thinks we can work with him to correct it. He hasn't bitten anyone, yet but growls at men and children. He is absolutely beautiful and my 11 mo. old female shiba adores him. I really want to do everything I can before putting him down. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

Brenda,

First, take 2 deep breaths. Second, is the dog reacting based on fear or being overly suspicious. In either case socialization will help. If it is just that the dog is unsure of the situation, socialization will help more if the dog is just "weak nerved/fearful". Some other things may figure in to this, including the clothing and equipment the Vet had.

It sounds like the vet may have over reacted a bit. I can see the point in muzzling a growling dog, but a 6 month old puppy I would think you should be able to work through it with out it. Third, muzzels carry a stigma in the US that is undeserved. It is an effective tool to use with a dog that you are unsure of. In other parts of the world, it is common to walk dogs with muzzles on all the time. It just makes for the elimination of a dog bite, it is a piece of equipment that is used like a leash. There is no stigma attached to it.

Richard,
I am very grateful for your quick response. The muzzle didn't bother me too much, the other vet doesn't use it. Some vets are more cautious than others. I'm just really worried I will not be able to break Tanner of his fear aggression from everything I've been reading. It sounds like a poor breeding problems, like mental illness and can never really be cured. But, I will do everything I can. I do feel the breeder should help me pay for the expensive therapy I'm about to embark on. Thanks again.

Brenda,

What expensive Therapy? Find a good obedience trainer, get some obedience in to the dog, and take him out to the park and have everybody you can find pet him. Go sit out side a grocery store and just let people come and pet him, or just sit and have him be calm and get used to the idea that people walking by aren't a threat. It shouldn't cost more than the obedience training he should have any way.

Richard,
I agree with you but he's already growling and snarling. I'm scared to let anyone near him now. I'm afraid he will bite. He does like the puppy park. He loves the other dogs and there are other people there. He usually let's women pet him but not all men and definitely not children. How do you feel about shock collars? I did use Sit Means Sit training on my first Shiba as I do agree all dogs should have training. We did not use the collar on her although they wanted to. I called them to say I have a new pup with a specific problem and he said I definitly need to use the collar. Another trainer told me you don't "use aggression with aggression". In other words, she recommends the clicker method. What training method do you like best?

Brenda,

I don't use shock collars and never have. I have been talking to Lou Castle and might consider useing a low level method of training for some work I want to do. Personaly I don't like the high stim method of using a shock collar. I have never seen anything done that way that I couldn't do with a leash.

I am not a fan of clicker training either. Sound basic obedience should do the trick with out much problem. With breeds that have some dominance issues I prefer to use obedience rather than a physical confrontation to cure this type of problem. Get the obedience to the point that the dog responds without thinking about it so that you can run a series of comands quickly to show that you can still make him do what you want.

If he likes the puppy park and some of the people there then it sounds like the problem is that he is mistrusting of strangers. I would make strangers, particularly men and later children, treat and/or pets machines.


Shebas are not a breed I am very familar with, so I looked them up. This would be typical of the breed based on what I saw as the description of the temperament, since they are listed as naturaly suspicious of strangers, particularly in males. With this type of a breed, early and frequent socialization will cure this. I do the same thing with the working dogs I train. By frequent I mean 2-4 times a week. I say that because I had a guy tell me he socialized his dog a lot...2-3 times a month, for a couple of months. He couldn't figure out why the dog was suspicious of strangers and dog aggressive.

Again take 2 deep breaths, calm down, and work the problem systematically. It doesn't sound as bad as you think it is. I haven't seen the dog, but if it will accept some people then it is more a question of experience with more people.

Brenda,
Hi, and welcome! I live in Las Vegas, so we're neighbors. An e-collar is not meeting aggression with aggression. I use one on my sensitive, fearful Sheltie, and it has given him confidence, and helped him to overcome his fears. The electronic collars available now have very low settings that do not need to be painful to the dog. The e-collar takes the emotion out of your corrections, and avoids a confrontation. I think it could be a great help to you. If you were comfortable with "Sit means sit" with your other dog, then let that be your guide. I don't agree with everything they do, but they are certainly a better option than a clicker trainer for your dog. I don't believe clicker training would work in this case. Believe me, learning to use an e-collar properly can be a real life-saver to you and your dog. I would not hesitate to use it, especially if you are going to get the help and training. FWiW
Where's Lou when we need him?

Hi Brenda, While I'm no profesional trainer I might be able to help. As I understand it Sheba's are in essence the miniature of the Akita. From what I've read they think they are Akita's at least in attitude. I have two Akita's a female almost 9years and a 10mth old male. My male thinks he's the biggest badest boy on the block and at a little over 100lbs he prob is. Most are scared of him and you can bet he knows it. They are experts at reading body langage and the males will show dominace and aggresion as early as 5 or 6mths. OBEDIANCE is the key. I bought Eds basic ob tape when my guy was 6mths and boy has it been a god send. It is just comon sense but the results were wonderful. I guess I'm very lucky as my vet is head over heals in love with my big boy. At his size (dogs) without the ob he would be imposible to handle. They are shy of strangers but you can overcome that as the other post have said. I've found that a simple no and a quick pop with p collar will bring him back to a sit at my side with no further noise from him. Also come is an absolute as you must be able to call him back no matter what. Some people aren't as smart as dogs and they don't get that antaginizing these guys is really stupid. At least where the Akita is concerned they do seem to have a learning block when it comes to the come comand so really work on that one. Hope this helps. Oh if it were my vet I would find another jmo. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I want to thank all of you for your kind support and information. I took both Tanner and Tessie to the puppy park this evening. Tessie is a lover although a tiny bit cautious at first. She is very gentle and I never worry about her. Tanner was very nervous at first, running around with his tail between his legs. The other dogs sensed his fear and started to gang up on him a little bit. Once he realized it was all play he started to participate. He did approach adults but not children. I sat with a women and her 10 yr old son and at first Tanner growled at him and ran away. I made Tanner sit beside me with the boy a few feet away. The boy did not touch Tanner but Tanner was able to sit near him and stopped growling. Later on he came up to the boy from behind and sniffed him but when the boy moved Tanner ran far away. All in all I feel much better with his behavior by the end of the evening. It seems evident to me that combining good disipline with a lot of socialization Tanner can eventually become more relaxed. He doesn't have to be the biggest lover but I want to be able to trust that he won't bite. I am definitely the leader of the pack and he is doing better every day on coming and sitting, obeying my commands. I have set an appt with a trainer on Oct 13th and hope to have good news for everyone in a few months. Wish me luck and I'll post his progress every now and then. Thanks again, I really like this site!
PS I wish I had spell check, my spelling is horrid!

Brenda,

Your spelling and typing are much better than mine!!