Im noticing my 20 month old rott bitch is starting to try and avoid having the check chain training collar placed on her prior to training. Once its on she seems OK and forgets about it. Does this mean Im pushing her too hard? Is it common for dogs to display this sort of behaviour? I intend to start using a ecollar as soon as possible. Will she also show signs of not wanting to wear that? She sort of ducks her head and moves it to one side as I go to lside the collar on. I pat her a lot and try to reassure her about it all but she still dosent like it. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

Dogs do form such associations and if your training sessions are unpleasant as far as she's concerned, then she'll try to avoid the choke chain or any other piece of equipment you care to use including the ecollar.

Yes, you can take this as a very strong hint to take a good hard look at your training methods, maybe with an outside trainer's (for an impartial opinion) help.

If she doesn't want to have the collar put on her, don't reassure her or you will be calling attention to the behaviour and reinforcing it. Just work on making the sessions more positive.
If the avoidance is really bad, then first change the way you train, then change the equipment you use, so you get a clean break with the association.

Collar avoidance is a problem I haven't had personally, one of the dear dogs went so far as to stick her head into the collar and try to flip it onto her neck -- training sessions are the best part of the day for them.

If you use an ecollar correctly, then there's no reason a dog should associate it with anything other than an opportunity to work. Dogs can take discomfort if it's fair, understood and leads to better things.

Brendan,

I wouldn't worry about it. If the dog seems worried about the leash I would be more concerned. Many dogs aren't too wild about having thier head held still to put on the slip collar. It is less of a problem with the e-collar as it buckles on rather than slipping on.

Collar awareness is more of a problem with some dogs than others. Just remember, a dog that is trained on leash often will not obey off leash-- a dog that is trained with e-collar on may also not obey with it off. The only way to find out is to try some obedience with it off. Additional training is usually needed.

10/27/2001 10:18 AM CDT

 Quote:

Originally posted by Dave Lilley:
a dog that is trained with e-collar on may also not obey with it off.

Let the dog get used to wearing the collar a few hours a day for a couple week before you even turn it on. That way you shouldn’t have any ‘collar association’ problems.

Also, when you do start utilizing the electronic stimulations, don’t apply any right after you put the collar on, wait a few minutes, throw a ball a few times or something, then start in with the training.

BTW, every time I put the e-collar on and take it off, my dog gets a treat. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I agree with K9 man. What I did when I first got my e-collar (I have a very hyper boxer). I initially did all of his obedience with a chain then a prong collar when we graduated to distractions and correction. When I wanted to use the e-collar for off leash, I would let him wear the collar, turned off, all day, just like a regular dog collar. I also went back to the chain collar, since that is what I usually take him out in. I started over with the obedience corrections with the chain. Of course they were near as respected as the choke, but that would soon get fixed. I also did this with the e-collar on his neck, but corrected with the chain. After a few sessions of this, I would correct with a e-collar (have to find the right setting for the type of correction needed), with the chain and leash still attached. The dog still thinks the correction is coming from the chain and not the e-collar. To avoid the dog avoiding the both collars, I put them on him through out the day and just have a fun time (ball, chase, swim (my e-collar is water proof) etc.) This way he doesn't always associate the collars with work. Has been very successful for me. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Any intelligent animal will associate the application of the collar with the discomfort of the correction. This seems, in my opinion, to be more prevalent with the e-collar. That's just my experience.

Originally posted by Hank Springer:
Any intelligent animal will associate the application of the collar with the discomfort of the correction. This seems, in my opinion, to be more prevalent with the e-collar. That's just my experience. I have to disagree and if this is your experience with any type of collar then you are using it incorrectly, in my opinion. All my dogs, from my 7 month old GSD to my 9 year old Dobermann wear a prong and ecollar whenever we go anywhere whether it's to train or just walk in the woods. That way, if I need to apply any type of correction I don't have to run to my training bag, get the collar, put it on, give a correction.......My dogs think I control them, not the collars on their necks.

I am surprised though how many people teach their dogs to avoid the collar, I see it at training every week. They wait til the dog screws up a couple times and then go get the ecollar and use it. Why not just have it on already?? You don't have to use it but are prepared just in case.

I think Hank is right, and this association can actually be useful. FOr instance, with Oka, my GSD, if I'm working him off-leash on OB and he gets lazy or stubborn, I stop, put the prong collar on him, and then "jerk him around" while repeating the OB he just screwed up on. Then I take the prong off, and he's almost always focused and precise again.

After all, I can't have a prong on him during a trial, but this way he knows there are consequences to screwing up even when the prong isn't on. (I don't use the e-collar this way, however, because the direct connection of the prong to my actions is more useful in this context. However, as someone noted, the e-collar is great for polishing or finishing off behavior.)

OTOH, like Cindy, if I'm walking him in the woods, I leave the e-collar on the whole time.

As I've said before , isn, itgreat that it all works to some extent.
Iuse all of te above and I agree. If used properly the dog will not mind. The best thing for the e-collar or any other is as stated let them wear it with out stimulation at times and they will be Ok unless you over do the corrections.
As for wanting the dog to kno that the correction is comining with the collar, as stated OB off leash screw up , put the collar on so he knows.
Thats bunk. Do you realy want your dog to know your going to nail him . ( here comes the collar . what the hell did I do this time?) If Im off leash and off e-collar and my dog screws up.or gets lazy, I grab some hair an ear, smack him on the noodle, what ever. I want him to know I can correct anytime any place with or with out equipment.
Ron