Hi everyone, I have a behavior related question about my GSD. Unfortunately, I think my dog is a fear biter toward other dogs. My question is, how do I help her get past this fear of other dogs?

I noticed it most recently at Easter. My extended family has a friendly, submissive Standard Poodle. My GSD was off leash at the time, I didn't have time to grab her before the poodle entered. Poodle goes up to sniff my dog, mine starts barking and going after her. I yell "NO" and she stops. Then she and the poodle were totally normal and played. My extended family also has a lab and this same thing happened (about a year ago), she went off at him (this time she was on leash and I corrected her) but then they played fine. I'd like to note that she does have dog "friends" which she's always been fine with and now we only play with these dogs.

When we are on walks around the neighborhood, she'll always raise her hair and stare down other dogs. We've worked on some desensitization, rewarding for eye contact w/ me and ignoring other dogs, but it seems the "reward" of seeing the other dog up close is more valuable than the treat/ball or food. At distances she's better of course, for example off leash (w/ e-collar) we frequently play fetch. Other dogs walk by at a distance on leash. She'll sometimes ignore, sometimes stare and then ignore these dogs. Nothing happens other than her being distracted.

She was beat up on as a pup as there was a lot of "dogs work things out on their own" with my family helping raise her. Or people saying "my dog is friendly and loves puppies" only to have them dominate/attack her. I should have stood up for her (i.e. pepper spray/large bat), now I realize this. We now avoid situations where other strange dogs come up and greet her, but I'd like her to just "move on" and realize she won't get attacked anymore. With large dogs (other GSDs, Great Danes, Irish Wolfhounds, etc) she'll balk and not want to get near them (even if I'm just passing them w/ both dogs leashed), I'm not really sure what this is about, my only guess is that she's afraid of them hurting her or the fact they are big. Yet she's been around horses and does not mind them, other than showing a healthy respect and keeping some distance. Ideally, I'd like her to just ignore other dogs.

Any tips?

"I think my dog is a fear biter toward other dogs. "



She has bitten another dog out of fear?

Or you fear that she might?

Well, my initial thought was that she bites other dogs out of fear. Yet it might be dominance? It's like an icebreaker: she'll raise her fur and bite/lunge at other dogs, then when they spend more time with each other (i.e. sniff rears) they get along okay. She's never drawn blood.

Well, I was asking "Has she bitten?" and I guess the answer is no, but she lunges and snaps?

We have many very detailed threads here about desensitizing reactive dogs (most of them about dog-reactive dogs).

If she is giving stink-eye, you are giving her far too much time to do it. If she is hackling and lunging, ditto. The threads about desensitizing will tell you in great detail how to start working with the dog outside her reactive range,

By any chance, have you read of these threads? If not, I can dig up a few, but might not be able to until tomorrow.

Also, we have several desensitizing experts who are regular posters.


"Ideally, I'd like her to just ignore other dogs."

Yes, exactly. This is what the advice in the desensitizing threads are aiming for, too.

She has been growled/snapped at when she was young in an effort of other dogs trying to dominate (i'd assume). She's never been full on bitten w/ blood and all that.

That's what I thought. I was always afraid of giving "unfair corrections." I wasn't sure if looking at other dogs was "giving the stink eye" or not, but I realize now staring at other dogs is definitely that. I've read some threads on dog-reactive desensitization before, but if you have specific ones that you recommend I'd love that. I'll search tonight to see what I find.

I was asking if she had bitten another dog (when you said "fear biter"), but I gather that no, she has lunged and snapped. Right?

You don't need to worry about corrections. You won't be correcting her; you'll be teaching her different behavior and she'll be learning how unimportant strange dogs are.

Desensitizing keeps the dog busy AND out of the range of reacting or, when that's impossible, keeps the dog moving much too fast to zero in with stink-eye or lunging. (The reactive range shrinks gradually.)


Do you know marker-training?

Sorry, no, she has not bitten. Just lunging and snapping only when a dog comes close enough that they sniff. If we are just walking, it's usually just hackles/staring, but she has lunged once or twice if the other dog provokes first.

Yes she's been trained with markers from puppyhood. My understanding of this desensitization is starting her focusing on me with distractions (other dogs) at a distance, where I know she is not reactive. Then slowly getting closer/rewarding to where she'll focus entirely on me and not other dogs.

So that's great, eventually she can learn to ignore other dogs. However, eventually I would like to introduce her to new dogs, either my friend's or my family's (not strangers), and I'd like her to be friendly with them too.

It may be that the best you'll get is for her to ignore other dogs. If she becomes friendly with any other dogs owned by your family and friends, that will be a bonus. But don't try and force the situation in any way.

I agree 100% with Elaine.

The gist for me is working with the dog, upbeat sessions with HV rewards, just outside her trigger range so she can focus on me instead of the trigger and let the trigger become mere background noise (desensitized to it). There are many ways to set this up, and there are lots more details about inserting myself between the trigger and the dog, starting the work in a completely distraction-free area to have a basis before taking it "on the road," teaching a simple focus command at home first, and much more.

But please post any questions you want after looking through these threads. This is something I work in a lot (with shelter rehabs as well as a few of my own over the years, and other people's), and it never stops being great when the recovering reactive dog is able to march on by one of his old triggers.

I have one of my own who was so dog-reactive when he came that his feet left the ground with the force of his barking and lunging. Now he walks right past the yard of his old arch-enemy, a fence-fighter, as if he didn't exist.


http://leerburg.com/webboard/thread.php?topic_id=24232&page=2#251710

http://leerburg.com/webboard/thread.php?topic_id=28694&page=2#312269

http://leerburg.com/webboard/thread.php?topic_id=24037&page=3#249885


This is a process, but it's a satisfying one, and it's a bonding one too. Not to mention the excellent ob that you will have!

 Quote: Elaine Haynes

It may be that the best you'll get is for her to ignore other dogs. If she becomes friendly with any other dogs owned by your family and friends, that will be a bonus. But don't try and force the situation in any way.

Okay that's what I figured, thank you.

 Quote: Connie Sutherland

I agree 100% with Elaine.

The gist for me is working with the dog, upbeat sessions with HV rewards, just outside her trigger range so she can focus on me instead of the trigger and let the trigger become mere background noise (desensitized to it). There are many ways to set this up, and there are lots more details about inserting myself between the trigger and the dog, starting the work in a completely distraction-free area to have a basis before taking it "on the road," teaching a simple focus command at home first, and much more.

But please post any questions you want after looking through these threads. This is something I work in a lot (with shelter rehabs as well as a few of my own over the years, and other people's), and it never stops being great when the recovering reactive dog is able to march on by one of his old triggers.

I have one of my own who was so dog-reactive when he came that his feet left the ground with the force of his barking and lunging. Now he walks right past the yard of his old arch-enemy, a fence-fighter, as if he didn't exist.


http://leerburg.com/webboard/thread.php?topic_id=24232&page=2#251710

http://leerburg.com/webboard/thread.php?topic_id=28694&page=2#312269

http://leerburg.com/webboard/thread.php?topic_id=24037&page=3#249885


This is a process, but it's a satisfying one, and it's a bonding one too. Not to mention the excellent ob that you will have!

One question I have is about HV rewards. How can I tell if the reward is too low or if it's just me pushing her too quickly?