Since Amber was a pup I've taught her to get in the car when I say "in" and "out" when I say out. I've usually had her sit and didn't release her until the out release. Then I got lazy, and haven't been having her sit before exiting. We've restarted working on this and I've noticed when she sits she is keeping one paw up in the air and will lean forward and wiggle a bit, she does keep her bottom planted and she does wait for the out word. Is the leaning and keeping a paw ok, or is this a form of not quite doing the command.

 Quote: Jodi Moen

Since Amber was a pup I've taught her to get in the car when I say "in" and "out" when I say out. I've usually had her sit and didn't release her until the out release. Then I got lazy, and haven't been having her sit before exiting. We've restarted working on this and I've noticed when she sits she is keeping one paw up in the air and will lean forward and wiggle a bit, she does keep her bottom planted and she does wait for the out word. Is the leaning and keeping a paw ok, or is this a form of not quite doing the command.

Well, I think it depends on what you want, and also whether you actually say "sit."

(Is "sit" a separate command here?)



If you are just saying waaaiiit for that release, then, for me, what she is doing is fine.

If you are actually saying "sit" (and she has a trained and proofed sit command and it has no paw in the air), then she's not doing the sit command.

So in that case, I would go back and work on "sit" again (away from the car setup), marking only the good ones.

Then I'd return to the car setup and give my sit command and not let her "out" unless the sit was right.


I'm interested in reading what others think!

What Connie said! If your looking for a formal sit then expect it.
The paw in the air can also be stress but more then likely here it's anticipation/excitement for the release.
Mark and release when the paw is put down.
If you use the marker word/click as a release you won't need the "in" or "out" command.
This is want I do with my two GSDs. They are also required to sit before they go in or come out of the car/gate/door/etc. In this instance the "yes" is also the freedom to go in or come out.
Since they are both excited to go in OR out of the car then that is the Reward for the marker "yes".
Both will run to get to my car in the drive and they don't really need the sit command anymore because I've simply said "car" and they know the routine.
ALSO, avoid marking every time you open the door or they can start anticipating the next mark that releases them to get in or out. Occasionally open and then close the door but still mark and reward the "sit" after you've closed the door.

Connie, I'm asking for the sit command with the hope that eventually she won't need it in the car, she has anxiety in the car(from a pup which is much improved) I did notice, and maybe she's been doing this all along when I have her sit on the trail she sometimes has a paw up.
Mr. Scott, I've been using the in and out commands as a starting point for other tasks, it seems to work and it is particularly helpful around the horses. Do you think using this as in this way and as a car command might be too general? In your last sentence is that with the dog outside of the car? When she gets antsy when we get to the conservation land if she stands I will wait for her to sit before I open the door, and if she stands after I open the door I will tell her to sit and close the door, and reopen when she has sat. I agree that the paw up and leaning are anticipation, the trip there is the highlight of her day.
If I'm understanding correctly, because I am asking for sit she should be doing a normal sit, no wiggling or paws up. Should I maybe instead of asking for sit, just mark when she does sit and not ask for it as a specific command?
I think I have made the mistake of marking each time I open the door so I'll have to train myself.

"Anxiety in the car"
This could be a lot of what's going on.
How important is that perfect sit with both paws on the ground if you using it for "in' and "out"? Like I commented you could use the marker itself for the release to go in or out.
Retraining yourself to NOT mark each time you open the dog will let her calm down a bit because she'll learn that she has to wait for the command and not just the door opening.
Use a bridge while she's sitting. A calm, soft "Gooood" "goooood" "goood" to hold he in position will also let her know she's doing right. Slooowly open the dog so she doesn't try and bolt. Use the bride while doing this. Keep your attitude high.

BTW, I'm Bob. Mr Scott is some worn out old man that probably owes someone some money.

mr scott . . . . lolololollol

The car-door "wait until released" is, as Bob notes, a high anxiety time to be teaching anything new. It is for my dogs--because if they are in the car, they are going somewhere fun and can't wait to get there.

But the same behavior can be taught at home without the distractions. I start first with the crate. Teaching "wait" (or whatever your word is) is pretty easy here.

Then move on to doors in your house--an interior door first (door between the bedroom and hall, for example--because there's no high-value "reward" on the other side of the door; it's just a hallway.)

Then move on to the door that goes out to the yard. Then the front gate. Then other doors in the outside world (the door at the vet's office, etc.)

By the time you get to the car door, the dog should have a pretty good understanding of what the command means, and offer the behavior. But IMO, you can't start teaching the thing in the highest-distraction location. So don't expect it there until it's solid in lower-distraction situations.

Eventually, the dog will generalize all doors as something that requires a release before proceeding through. But I think you'll find it's easier to START teaching the "wait" with a crate or baby gate with hundreds of repetitions before you expect a solid "wait" when the car door opens.

VERY important point by Tracy, and IMO it goes for all commands.

In fact, we just went through an explanation of "start indoors, with zero excitement, zero distractions" on the "knowing when a dog knows a command" thread.

Tracy shows in detail how that progression from "no distraction" works, and how the command doesn't begin at a spot that's already exciting and distracting.

Kinda like teaching the release into my hand (for fetch) in the living room .....

My dog is already anticipating getting in or out of the car (she doesn't lift a paw, but she leans and focuses really hard on the door and my hand). Like Bob, I release with a marker and let the release be to go where she wants as the reward. The only difference I see is that I don't use my reward marker ("yes"). I have a separate release marker ("Ok").

I rarely have to command in or out. If she is too anxious to get in, I will command her to "wait", which does require a sit. I then can either command "hup" (jump up in the truck) or release her with an "Ok". Either work the same. Getting out is just a matter of releasing her, as she is already set to get out.
If she is not sure about a new place, she sometimes hesitates before she gets out. I guess I could teach a new command for that, but "Are you coming with me?" works every time. I kinda like that better than having her obey a command when she is unsure about getting out.