I'm hoping for some tips to take the headache out of having my two Malinois around our horses. I searched and found http://leerburg.com/webboard/thread.php?topic_id=33049&page=1 but I did not find much there to help me get my dogs to where I would like them to be with regard to the horses.

Although we keep the dogs separated from the horses, the two Malinois are constantly wanting to harass the horses. They'll pace the fence of the pasture, barking at the horses or lunging at the fence anytime the horses are close. Through leash corrections and reminders with an e-collar, the dogs have learned to behave when I am in proximity. They will still pace the fence, but they will not bark when I am outside with them. I can call them away from the fence and they will obey. It is when I am not close by to supervise them that they choose to allow their prey drive to take over.

I have been managing the situation with bark collars and containment in crates but I'm really hoping for some suggestions to truly remedy the behavior rather than just manage the behavior. I had hoped that over time and through the constant corrections that they would eventally lose interset in the horses. That has not been the case.

Ideally the dogs would be able to be loose around the horses and ignore them. Ideally the dogs would not be chasing after the horses and trying to bite them. Ideally we would be able to ride the horses with the dogs loose and there would not be any agression. We are a long way from being ideal . I would be happy if the dogs while still separtated by the pasture fence could be left loose in the yard and without my presence not pay the horses in the pasture any mind.

My entire acerage is securely fenced. I would prefer to leave the dogs loose, especially in my absence, but because the dogs constantly pace the pasture fence or go into the barn to harass the horses and keep up with their incessant barking when I am not there to stop them, the dogs spend much more time in their crates than I'd prefer.

Any suggestions to remedy the situation so I can have these Malinois ignore the horses will be much appreciated.

To me it sounds like part of the problem, if I'm reading what you wrote correctly is that the dogs are able to see the horses and continue the behavior unsupervised at times?
Every part of densitization has to be 100% consistent. If you work with them then allow them to access the fence unrestricted to bark, you are never going to change the behavior, ever,imo.
Is there any way you can change their location from the fence so they can't see the horses when they're unsupervised, maybe put plywood up as a visual barrier?
Then only allow them to sight the horses when you are able to work with the dogs. Its important to remember horses=prey, dogs=predator.
I have horses and can understand the frustration, but each horse is different, each dog is different. My last dog could be around any horse without supervision, my dog previous to that was kicked in the shoulder and could not be around unsupervised. My current dog is on a on leash only basis around them, I am in the process of desenstizing her and it is most likely she will never be off leash around them, my young horse is locked and loaded around her and this is without barking.
I would look up the desensitivation threads. I was thinking BAT might help but it all depends on why your dogs are barking at them. jmho. Good luck.

It is very hard. At the moment I have 10 horses and 2 dogs. 1 will not even think of chasing the horses, the other one got to the point where he will only think of chasing if the horses are running hard or being lunged.

They both spend a lot of time on drag line and I have very good electric fences that are low enough for the dog to get zap.

I some situation I just put one or both dogs away.

I work this just like cat chasing. Most of my horse are reactive and will run or charge and boarders will not like to have a dog chase their horse.

Also providing the dogs with lots of energy draining activity does help.

My remedy is to have the dog be around the horse lots more, close up. I'm thinking the dog can learn this is "Flicka", not some prey-object, this is someone you know. One dog at a time, have dog be in the barn when the horse is in cross ties, when the horse is relaxed and being groomed. Any fixation on the horse, any barking or predatory action gets a ridiculously stern correction, as in a plastic fork thown near the dog, a plastic fork wacked on the dogs head if it doesn't lay off, shut up, give it up, think of something else. In a young dog, I correct for looking at cattle or horses with a predatory look. Look away or be corrected, this is "friend" not
a squirrel.

I allow my dogs to eat horse manure: that is as much interaction with horses as I permit.

Once 2 dogs get livestock "going" control is impossible to achieve in my experience. You have to keep them from practicing that behavior.
I have 2 herding dogs, one big and athletic, one small and not so fierce. I struggle with this as well, when moving the cattle. ONE DOG AT A TIME has helped me greatly.
If they start getting better, I'd throw a frisbee outside the pasture fence, "that's what we chase" and give crazy strong correction for fixating on the horses instead.
I'm struggling with something similar with a collie who wants to chase cars.

Jodi: I follow what you're saying. I strive to be consistent, but I have been guilty of lapses, but less & less so since I have learned that any faith placed in these dogs in this regard is faith misplaced. The younger Mal is loose only when I am outside with him to monitor his behavior. The older Mal I'll leave loose if the horses are in the stalls because the older Mal doesn't harrass the horses in the stalls like the younger Mal will. If the horses are loose in the pasture I contain that Mal, too, so she doesn't pace the fence line.

Ariane: These dogs get a good amount of exercise running 4 miles with me several days a week, playing in the pond and chasing squirrels, but let's face it, it's tough to tire out a Mal.

Betty: I have doled out some stiff corrections, which is why I believe the dogs restrain themeselves when I am present to monitor them. There have been times when I have been inside of the house when I still tried leaving the dogs loose and I would see the dogs look to the house to see if I was looking out of the window ready to correct them. If they see me, they behave. If they didn't see me, they'd act up until I gave them a verbal correction.

The bottom of your post reads "looking for training avenues". Perhaps trying to harness the desire to move livestock-perhaps herding training, for the younger Mal? I see you are in Florida
(you LUCKY DUCK !) I think inland and perhaps north of you there is quite a bit of herding.

I correct my dogs for thinking about running after the horse.
My crazy dobe would be like what's next after a 5 miles run. That one does nosework, ob, agility and lots of play with me.

But he could play fetch for hours on end if I could throw the ball. Once in pray drive he need to calm down or he just keep going with no end to it. If a let out a "ENOUGH" in the barn every one, horses, cats and dogs stop in their tracks.

I think that it is very possibly an unreasonable expectation for 2 drivey dogs to be loose unsupervised in the OPs situation and leave the horses alone.

Mara may have hit the nail on the head, but I'm not ready to give up, yet. I will never attempt to allow these dogs unsupervised access, solo or as a pair, around the horses. At a minimum there will always be a fence separating them. I would like for the dogs to realize that their satisfaction will be limited due to the fence and give up harassing the horses through the fence and rather pay attention to the house and the front of the property which I'd like them to patrol.

Ariane, I'm on board with a stern "ENOUGH!" Sometimes I just make the dogs lay down in kind of a time out to establish control and take away some of the frenetic running & pacing. As I mentioned, when I am present to admonish them even just verbally, they will behave. It is when I am out of sight or not paying attention to them that they take advantage.

Betty, I have contacted some local trainers in search of someone close who put me in touch with someone who may train dogs for hunting or herding, thinking they may have suggestions so as to get the dogs to re-direct their attentions, but I have come up dry on any resource of that type.

I will keep at it though. Perhaps being diligent with control through crating when I am not outside with them and stern corrections when they do pay the horses any attention in my presence? My goal is to allow the dogs to be loose anytime day or night without supervision so as to keep an eye on the property, but that just isn't in the cards right now.

I'd start correcting for the start of any sort of predatory sequence. With my husky, he has a pronounced freeze before he begins a chase. My other dogs watch for this and so do I- and I stop the chase sequence right there with a recall. Once the dog has started running and chasing, it takes a very hard correction to snap them out of it. Especially if there are two or more dogs involved.

I'd take the dogs one at a time and watch carefully for that sign that the chase sequence is starting. If they are like my malinois, they might actually look to you briefly before taking off running and barking, etc. That is when you give them an alternate command- come, platz, catch this Frisbee... whatever. If they continue with the predatory sequence, then a correction is in order.

I may be wrong, but I'm not sure malinois make the best independent property patrol type dogs- livestock guardians or mastiff types might be better suited for this. Or even a collie-type farm dog for the early bark alert. Malinois have really active minds and like to interact with people. Combine that with high prey drive and a certain amount of defense drive and...they'll get in trouble if left alone and to their own devices. So I'd keep the dogs close and consistently correct for predatory behavior around the horses.