Peter Cavallaro wrote 01/06/2015 05:21 PM positional familiarity #396188 - 01/06/2015 05:21 PM
Peter Cavallaro Webboard User Reg: 07-09-2010 Posts: 536 Loc: Offline	when doing obed I have had 3 dogs in 3 crates (YES I USE CRATES) right next to each other and 1 dog out. dogs are only ever in crates for training time. the dogs have always gone to "their own" crate an I never let a different dog in it, no real reason just what I do. I bought an extra crate and put it in first position and moved all the other crates along, cos it fit the space better that way. sending the dog to the crate after training so I can get another dog has caused mayhem, the dogs are fighting me to get the old crate position and not "their" crate. the crates have only moved 2 feet to the left. this is weird the familiar smells/sights mean less than the position the crate was sitting. I dunno I find this bizarre and not what I would have expected. comments on what is happening?
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Michael Soldwisch wrote 01/06/2015 06:18 PM Re: positional familiarity [Re: Peter Cavallaro ] #396189 - 01/06/2015 06:18 PM
Michael Soldwisch Webboard User Reg: 02-21-2012 Posts: 146 Loc: Michigan Offline	Interesting, that's a good one. No explanation for this over here.
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ian bunbury wrote 01/06/2015 08:58 PM Re: positional familiarity [Re: Peter Cavallaro ] #396193 - 01/06/2015 08:58 PM
ian bunbury Webboard User Reg: 01-19-2012 Posts: 685 Loc: whistler bc ca Offline	just a great example of how tuned a dogs' " spatial awareness " is . . . they are not as concerned with the familiarity of their box as they are with what has become " their space " and its' relative position to the " others' space " . and given that it sounds like you have been pretty stringent about each dog in specific crates , they are probably dealing with what they think is going to be your reaction if they don't go to " their space " . pretty interesting observation , pete . . . dogs : the best part of being human
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Cathy Goessman wrote 01/06/2015 09:03 PM Re: positional familiarity [Re: Peter Cavallaro ] #396194 - 01/06/2015 09:03 PM
Cathy Goessman Webboard User Reg: 12-03-2007 Posts: 1231 Loc: Phoenix, AZ Offline	My parents have 4 dogs and 3 of them have very similar bowls. If I feed them I occasionally mix up whose bowl is whose. Only one dog seems to realize that "his" bowl is not in front of him. He doesn't care but I can see that half second "what's up with this?" expression on his face. If you have to change the location of the bowls by even 6 inches or so they react noticeably.
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Tracy Collins wrote 01/06/2015 09:12 PM Re: positional familiarity [Re: Peter Cavallaro ] #396196 - 01/06/2015 09:12 PM
Tracy Collins Webboard User Reg: 10-09-2008 Posts: 1917 Loc: St. Louis, Missouri Offline	Mine all line up shoulder to shoulder in the same position at mealtime. When one dog passed away, the rest of the pack continued to reserve his space in the line-up. When I later added a new dog he, stepped into the blank spot in the meal line, and the rest of the dogs were okay with that. Cinco | Jack | Fanny | Ellie | Chip | Deacon
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Betty Landercasp wrote 01/06/2015 09:47 PM Re: positional familiarity [Re: Peter Cavallaro ] #396198 - 01/06/2015 09:47 PM
Betty Landercasp Webboard User Reg: 11-30-2009 Posts: 3724 Loc: minnesota Offline	Only an observation that cattle will fight, pretty hard, about their stanchions, the place they are tied up in a barn for eating and resting. Place seems pretty important. In a "place" one can be certain what will happen. In a new place, well, who knows? http://s922.photobucket.com/albums/ad67/Grasvaly/
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Greg Meyer wrote 01/07/2015 08:44 AM Re: positional familiarity [Re: Peter Cavallaro ] #396208 - 01/07/2015 08:44 AM
Greg Meyer Webboard User Reg: 12-24-2009 Posts: 482 Loc: Dayton, OH Offline	Not surprising. When we had two dogs, our Mal Bailey and our other dog, a mutt named Tasha, we kept them in separate crates in our bedroom when we had to leave the house. Due to Tasha's age and beginning stages of senility, she also slept there at night. They were along one wall, with Tasha's crate more in the corner and Bailey's more further up along the wall. At one point, we had to slightly rearrange things, which meant moving Tasha's crate 90 degrees to be against the other wall in the same corner her crate was in previously. You would have thought her world was coming to an end. She barked, she cried, she had to be coaxed into the crate in the new position. We finally made the connection as to the cause of all her anxiety and moved things back to where they were originally and she settled back down in very little time. We chalked some of it off to her being so senior and set in her ways but it made us appreciate how much dogs depend on routine and consistency. Bailey
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Duane Hull wrote 01/07/2015 01:26 PM Re: positional familiarity [Re: Peter Cavallaro ] #396216 - 01/07/2015 01:26 PM
Duane Hull Webboard User Reg: 09-23-2011 Posts: 2692 Loc: Marrero, LA Offline	And to think, many modern dog philosophers want to discount the existence and relevance of pack structure in today's modern dog. Tthe dog's ability to recognize his place in line is a sure sign of pack mentality. If the dogs were left to decide for themselves which crate was theirs, pack hierarchy would also come into play. The way that Tracy manages his pack removes the social hierarchy (which can interfere with peace in the human home), and a new dog is able to step into an old member's place. In a wild pack, the new member would start at the bottom and move his way up by displacing more senior members if he is able to. In the wild pack, this is crucial, as the higher ranking members get first access to resources which are crucial for survival. Sadie
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Tracy Collins wrote 01/07/2015 03:21 PM Re: positional familiarity [Re: Peter Cavallaro ] #396226 - 01/07/2015 03:21 PM
Tracy Collins Webboard User Reg: 10-09-2008 Posts: 1917 Loc: St. Louis, Missouri Offline	"Resources"--in the broadest sense--are really the key to managing a pack of dogs, IMO. Dogs all have to believe that all resources flow from me. (food, water, attention, toys, space, access). And, they can never have any worry that they have to protect their share of anything, because I will distribute fairly and I will make sure that they don't have to fight a pack member to keep what I've given them. If all needs are provided, and there is no need for competition (and no toleration for it), competition doesn't happen. Cinco | Jack | Fanny | Ellie | Chip | Deacon
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Duane Hull wrote 01/07/2015 03:42 PM Re: positional familiarity [Re: Peter Cavallaro ] #396228 - 01/07/2015 03:42 PM
Duane Hull Webboard User Reg: 09-23-2011 Posts: 2692 Loc: Marrero, LA Offline	Classic example of managing resouces in order to maintain harmonious pack life... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tHvExOg4NI0 Sadie
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