Socks, one of my Pits is an excessive licker. Once she started she didn't want to stop any more.

I know that licking is certainly a way of a dog to show his affection. I know there exist other reasons for this too, though I don't know enough about those.

In the beginning I certainly made the mistake to simply allow it and just took a good shower afterwards. But I found it annoying to have my legs "washed" non-stop when I sat on the veranda.

I then allowed 2-3 licks and depois said "leave it", a command she knows very well from other situations like food on the floor or wanting to pick up certain objects.

I said this consistently and sometimes had to push her away. She obeys in between, but after a while she comes back, licks and I have to begin the whole procedure again. Maybe this now is just a matter of patience and going on with consistent forbidding. But I'm not sure.

Where is my fault? What should I do?

Options:

1) Should I forbid it strictly right when she starts? Frankly I'd rather not like to forbid it totally, as it is an intrinsic need. Can I allow it a few times and give her my command when it's enough?

2) Start training this in a formal way in the training lab first,- clear: with marker training -
and once she's got it down transmit it gradually to real life situations.

3) All this remembers me also on the great article Mara gave me some time ago from

https://eileenanddogs.com/2016/06/25/ignoring-bad-dog-behavior/

Part oft it: "Sometimes we deliberately ignore behavior as part of a training plan. We do it in a controlled way in combination with reinforcing a different behavior." (Definitely don't want to ignore
it. But perhaps allowing it 3 times is already ignoring? ...)

Later Eileen writes: You allow the unwanted behavior for a certain amount of time. This time will "work against you because you have just taught your dog to be more persistent." (But if after 3 times I stop it?)

Eileen:"We must make sure it(-the different behavior -) pays as high or higher in reinforcement as the original."

But what behavior can replace the undesired licking?
A simple Sit would certainly not be more attractive than the licking. E.g. Would I have to run each time for a chase, a game or what?

4) use an E-Collar to make the animal avoid the behavior???

Thanks so much, if anyone has experience with this and a perhaps a suggestion.

 Quote: Christina Stockinger

Socks, one of my Pits is an excessive licker. Once she started she didn't want to stop any more.

Eileen:"We must make sure it(-the different behavior -) pays as high or higher in reinforcement as the original."

But what behavior can replace the undesired licking?

A simple Sit would certainly not be more attractive than the licking. E.g. Would I have to run each time for a chase, a game or what?

4) use an E-Collar to make the animal avoid the behavior???

Thanks so much, if anyone has experience with this and a perhaps a suggestion.

I would engage her MOUTH in another / acceptable Oral Activity...

Sometimes my female wants to entertain herself in the crate overnight by LICKING her own extremities, which slobbering sound I find annoying for whatever reason -- So I always keep a knuckle bone in the crate ... When I tell her to "!Quit That Licking!", I also say, "!Get Your Bone!" When it comes time that she will no longer re-direct, then I put in a FRESH bone & all is well again (I find the sound of dogs gnawing on a bone to be soothing, because they feel contented while doing that, so I keep a beef knuckle in my male's crate too).

Licking is often a stress response. So corrections could backfire.

I agree with Candi's advice - teach/provide an alternative for her to use her mouth.

We have an obsessive licker here as well. He listens when I tell him to knock it off because he knows otherwise I will kick my leg back into him or pop my arm against his mouth depending on what the licking target is. Simple and it works.

A little self control is NOT unreasonable to expect.

Thanks Candy, Mara and Cathy. Yes that redirection on a boné or something like that sounds very promising, much more reinforcement than my own long bones!

I guess, that when I start training this, I will first have to go with her to the kennel to make her enjoy that boné quietly for herself. Staying together with us would probably be too difficult to start with.

I'm not a fan of lickers so I stop it from the start.

Trooper still tried to sneak one in but a simple, low growl from me changes his mind.

Licking can also become a cumpulsive behavior with some dogs.

Self licking in certain breeds in particular Dobes being the one that comes to mind.

 Quote: Bob Scott

Licking can also become a cumpulsive behavior with some dogs.
Self licking in certain breeds in particular Dobes being the one that comes to mind.

Oh, yes, very true. One of my Dobermans has been a compulsive foot-licker (his own feet) off and on throughout his life. He's been on a roll lately. A "Leave It" command, or in my home, the phrase "No Lick!" works, but will probably have to be repeated a few minutes later. At least he's never gotten to the point of creating sores or hairless areas.

He doesn't try to lick me very often, but if I happen to use Blu Emu cream for my sore joints, or certain other lotions, he really loves the smell and taste of those and wants to lick it off of me, which makes me wonder, Christina, if you are using some type of body lotion that he is attracted to.

I also made the accidental discovery that certain kinds of pain relief ointments we humans may use, the stinky ones like Ben-Gay, etc., serve, in my household anyway, as a very effective dog repellant! Neither of mine will come near me or even want to be in the same room if I use that. I don't know if that's something Christina would want to try because she and everyone around her would have to put up with the smell, too.

I agree with the advice to distract and/or redirect the dog to a different activity when he is trying to lick your legs. You also might try making the activity unavailable to him by covering your legs with a light fabric, weather permitting, at least for a short period of time until he's gotten the idea out of his mind for a while.

Hi Candi, Mara, Cathy, Bob!

I've given a lot of thoughts to that awful licking and read all your answers again and again.

I think, I should have stopped it from the very start. But fact is, I haven't done it. My corrections didn't helped in this case. I guess, this was more like a game for Socks, same thing with a low growl, Bob. Probably mine is not as threatening as your's.

With stronger corrections I only just started. It surprised her a bit to get kicked, but licking seems to be too great a pleasure.

So, I'll have to see what effect it has after a few days, when done consistently after already just a trial to lick.

I also think in Socks case, I will have to choose Cindi's and Mara's way of re-direction. Only problem with this: She will first have to understand the procedure, learn it separated from the other dogs. A bone will always be attractiv for her.

But - ! - once she's savvied this, I will have to find and train the transition to another attractive behavior, because once doing it on the veranda, the other dogs will want to have a bone too.

Not that I'm stingy, but this will unavoidably lead to "envy" and easily to an outbreak of aggression, especially from Slippie.

So, can I start to train with redirection in the kennel but at the same time continue with stronger corrections when we're all together?

But thanks to you all!

The only down side to redirection is in it's timing.

Done wrong the dog maybelieve it's being rewarded for the licking.

When you give the "NO" or "Quit" wait a few seconds then mark and reward the act of quitting or NOT licking.

The others here will give their methods of redirecting.

I'm waiting meanwhile longer than a few seconds. Then she doesn't re-start licking for a while, it varies, 2 min, 5 min ..., but suddenly she comes and licks again. I give her my word for "quit" but she doesn't stop, unless I really kick her.

I wanted to avoid her to associate the reward with licking, as you're saying. But maybe I'm waiting too long and she might associate the reward already with something else?

Damned, it now dawns on me slowly, that it was highly idiotic to reward after the kicking. This is a correction and she will connect those two things. Stupid I! I'm desensitizing her against the correction. It must be either a reward if she stops for a while after my "Quit" or a correction and then no reward.

Do you agree with this?