Can any sport be trained in FIGHT drive?

My ringsport helper says that most of his advanced dogs are working in FIGHT drive at least part of the time.

The advanced dogs work on a suit and NEVER win / carry off the prey. They seem to be extremely tough but clear headed and confident... the harder they're pushed the harder they fight. Is it possible that these are just tough prey dogs?

Is a quality dog the key in ANY sport if you wish to work in fight drive? Or, are some sports strictly limited to prey work?

I'm gonna bet on tough prey. Take off the suit and put on a muzzle. Then approach the dog in an aggressive dominate threatening manner, off field, without using any movement that could illicit a prey response and see what happens.

Hey, just worked both my dogs in the suit last night. I agree with VanCamp. My SchH III male is all prey. He puts way more fight in the suit than the arm but he's still prey. He doesn't want to out, he gets dirty, he loves it when the helper fights him, but he's still a prey dog. I can say the suit centers up my dog's hold and bark. Dante didn't carry off the jacket last night either. I think it's how the dog's foundation training was trained. Dante was worked all in prey and got locked in to it. I don't know much about suit training other than I love having my dogs worked on it once and awhile. I guess what I am trying to say is Dante puts a lot more fight into the suit but he's still working in "tough" prey.

I think I may try some muzzle work. I'd like to see how my dog would work with that.

My dog too is MASIVE PREY and because she was a little TOO social (no human could do wrong in her eyes) and too fixed on that prey item. I started doing training on hidden sleeve (NO JUTTEN SLEEVE) with different type of clothing over it. Result I´m seeing is a GREAT bark and hold (quite hold). And not so fixed on that Jutten sleeve anymore.

I was also thinking of trying muzzle but she very used it and in order to make it work correctly the dogs have to bite in that muzzle piece just before and during their impact otherways they can hurt them. And that is why I´m still waiting because I´m not sure how I can make sure that she bites in muzzle piece everytime during impact.

How can you build a good prey foundation without becoming "locked into prey"? How do you know when the dog is ready to work in other drives?

Periodically, Dave, I will do prey guarding exercises as I think the dog is maturing in his work. I also will start to add minute amounts of pressure when I think the grip is advancing, but not 100% yet. This should itch a dogs defensive drive lightly during the bite work without much pressure. Say like begining civil tie out work. The goal is to keep some focus on the helper as the dog has progressed in his bite work. Then when you get those first little signs of defense that is when you move forward.

Light tests along the way.

If that helps any.

Dave,

There are a couple of things we do starting fairly early. If the dog is really fixed on the sleeve, to the point of ignoring the person, the agitator will remind the dog he is there. The agitator will harrass the dog enough to get it to drop the sleeve and go back after them with no protection. I will then also pull the dpg back just far enough that it can't reach the sleeve so that agitator can go back and get it and give another bite.

The other thing is that we start with "civil" work early in the program. Agitating the dog with no protection. This is done with both prey and defense postures. Along the same vein, when the dog is being agitated the sleeve is often put behind the back of the agitator so the dog is only seeing the bar arm. The big idea is to show the dog that the concern is the person, not the equipment. Another thing that we do is multiple sleeves in the begining.

I think that the biggest thing is to get the dog going early with civil work in addition to the prey work. The dog has to stay focused on the person, if it doesn't he needs a reminder, from the begining.

I like the multiple sleeves.. that has worked well for us..

another thing we do, is put the sleeve behind the back in the H&B... until the dog is barking into the eyes of the helper (with a real heavy bark, not a prey yip), the sleeve won't pop

Matt M. how do you use the multiple sleeves?

2 different ways

one, the helper holds one sleeve in clear view, with the second behind his back… as the dog comes in for the bite, the visible sleeve is tossed aside and the second sleeve is presented.

The other is simply to always have a secondary sleeve so that the dog can be easily "refocused" on the helper after the slip..

Both applications, aid in keeping a dog from becoming too prey-locked and or equipment focused..

I hope that makes sense